Your right...that IS a great insecticide for killing all the pests that ever think to bother our precious plants. However...that "warnings" part of that label is very scary. It tells you to call a Dr. if you even get it on your skin or clothing, & then the note to the Dr. says that there is no antidote available & to just treat the symptoms. LOL
I think this is the same insecticide that is in the Bayer Tree and Shrub liquid that I used for years at one ounce per gallon and loved the way I never had to spray anything for bugs. However,... I have now been reading that it is responsible for the decline in the bee population and that if people keep using this stuff on the plants that bees use the flowers of, soon there will be no bees to polinate anything. Also very scary predictions. I think now I will stick to spraying them with neem oil & soap water. It is not as trouble free as the Bayer product and the plants will get more insects to deal with, but I don't really want to contribute to the demise of the bees and other pollinators of the Earth. I guess if you keep your plants in a house, or greenhouse that never gets any pollinators visiting, then all you would have to worry about is that warning label. ...and...to make sure you never let any of it get into the rivers or streams of the Earth.

I'll stick with my safer methods, as I won't have to worry about any Dr. not being able to treat me, nor me poisoning any animals either. LoL Thanks though. ;)

Burt's bee lemongrass soap actually worked pretty darn good with a small dash of Murphy's soap in for the neem oil in it, to get rid of the aphids on my Datura. I'm thinking I'll just hang with that. :D My Datura is doing splendid now and all the aphids are gone!

~Tina

I don't want to worry you about this product.
BUT... If you own a cat and use that Advantage (almost all flea-tick repellents contain forms of imidacloprid) stuff on their coat, you're already using this product. I believe this is on their skin. But the amount in this pesticide is just 1G as opposed to higher dosages used to kill fleas, ticks, and guess what else, if you ever had a bed bug infestation, I am 100% sure you aren't planning to use a organic based soap to get rid of these pests. Most people who get bed bug infestations want 100% control, not just a OK organic approach. Guess what the Bed Bug pest control agents use (IN YOUR HOME MIND YOU!) to combat this pest. But I can assure you that this one used for sucking insects for plants is so minute, I don't think you would know.
Any way, I don't own a cat and I don't have a flea, tick or bed bug infestation. But in case you do, I hope they don't have to be used INSIDE YOUR HOME. Imagine sleeping in this stuff just so you could be 100% bed bug free? Imagine that!

RFG...thanks so much for the information, I'll certainly check this out. Currently I use BATS to control pests, however, I only use it on indoor plants, and my pets have no access to plants. This product sounds easier to use than mixing up dozens of jugs of BATS in order to treat my 500+ houseplants. Again, thanks so much, you've really offered a lot of great advice to this forum over the past few weeks...I'm so glad you're sharing with us. Fondly, Patrick

MY experience with Imidacloprid products -its great killing

scales & aphids but white flies has developed good immunity againstÃÂ it

Thanks. I have learn a lot from you.
sue

Whew! Bed bugs are a nasty critter to be certain. I've been fortunate not to come across that little beast. :) Makes me itch just thinking of them! lol

Fleas are another beast though, we do get those supposedly. I've not seen any on my two dogs. No cats though. And yes, I do learn much from you RFG and appreciate everything I do learn. So Thank you! :)

~Tina

Well, I do hope no one got offended or took what I said wrong. I also appreciate all the great info. shared on here & we are all free to take & leave what we want. I have also used that product for years. I just get get a bit nervous when I read lables like that and hear about the bees & all. But I am also surely grateful that there is a forum like this to share all kinds of good info to choose from.

The info shared here is right, Imidacloprid is used directly on a pets skin to control fleas and it is very effective at what it is intended to do. The problem is that these are in-discriminant killers in an uncontrolled environment. If any insect drinks nectar, gathers pollen or sucks plant sap they are all as good as dead.
France has banned this entire class of pesticides after a massive die off of their bee population. The bee populations world wide are in serious trouble. I urge everyone who uses these pesticides to educate themselves on the current situation concerning pollinating insects and then decide if there is not another approach that you find more appropriate.
I grow most of my plants indoors and if there is a serious problem with pests I will resort to using systemic insecticides but before that happens I use Neem, dish soap or alcohol to try to deal with the pests first. Use of these systemics outdoors will kill all insects and even nectar feeding birds like hummingbirds that eat frequently and would easily accumulate a toxic dose. If a plant is flowering outdoors the use of systemics will drastically increase pollinator deaths.

I urge everyone to read the article I posted and then decide if you are going to use these products what you are going to do to mitigate damage to insect pollinators.

In Szechuan Province China there are no bees as a result of heavy pesticide use. Still after stopping the use of these pesticides bees have not returned and the many fruit trees of the region must be hand pollinated or else produce no crop.

Mike

Here is a link that might be useful: Imidacloprid in France

Mike--thanks for the timely and interesting info. (as usual)..I couldn't agree more...I don't like to use ANY insecticides if I can avoid it, and, probably because I live where we have cold winters, I've never had a serious pest problem...this year I brought in some aphids (those bright yellow milkweed aphids, which are kind of neat looking) and I remove them with a blast of cold tap water...it may take a few "showers" to get rid of them completely, but it does work...

Those "big gun" pesticides, whose use is questionable under any circumstances, were designed for commercial growers and farmers, not little hobby collections kept in the house...kind of like killing a fly with a cannon...hope everyone here will at least consider milder methods for their house plants...

I haven't seen a European honey bee in my yard for the last 3 years...it's very sad...

Bees are gone not only due to pesticide over-use. yes it did play a part in the bee's demise, but let's face it, bees have been disappearing due to teh parasites that affect them. They have a bunch of parasites that are the true culprits of the loss of the honey bee. DDT couldn't wipe them out, many of the modern insecticides are actually safer than what homeowners used to use (now banned) Malathion, Diazinon, etc. Not from commercial big gun growers but homeowners as well.
This insecticide is a nicotine derivative and has shown its effectiveness when used with care. Everything needs to be addressed and used with care, even these safe pesticides since I have seen more people using them more frequently because if its lesser kill range. Not sure what is worst, using this systemic granule every 3 months for using the safe stuff every week. I do not like to mix chemicals, even safe ones. I have given up growing desert rose because this is a plant that requires constant spraying to stay alive. No thanks!
Hoyas biggest pest is sucking insects. I would rather use a systemic on targeted plants than liberally spraying liquid solutions on massed plants. Wind drift is dangerous and it is difficult to get 100% of the plant covered.
You miss a spot, they will recover and multiply again from that missed zone.
It's your choice. But there is something that works and if you're like me, I don't need to mix anything to spray a plant. Since I only grow ornamentals, my pesticide use is minimal and one fits all for me.

I have to agree that the big guns are not needed just for a case of aphids but when you get mealies,scale or spider mits you will need a systemic.
I really tried every safe thing I could find last winter to rid a few of my plants of root mealies and I ended up losing a few very large hoyas to this nasty bug.I had to go get bats and have only had to use it once and have not seen another mealy since last winter.

Cindy

I am resorting to Bonide houseplant systemic insecticide after a losing battle with mealies and scale. Its active ingredient is also imidacloprid, but at only .22%. I'm wondering if I should up the dose?

Interesting thread and interesting product. I saw this at a local landscaping supply company and I wish I could use it, but they way the majority of my plants are potted, the granules would just rinse right through.

I admit I use the big guns. As I grow outside, I get very few sucking insects (other than mites but that's another story), as apparently I support a whole colony of anoles. But I get many insects that like to live in the pots. As I am converting to completely inorganic media, I have less and less but still there are some. And insects seriously freak me out!!!!

I rotate currently between two, Sevin and Bayer Complete Insect Killer. Yes the warnings of any insecticide can be scary to those who don't understand them, but then again try reading the MSDSs of bleach or IPA.

As for the bee problem, even Bayer has warnings on their label now about not spraying while bees are active, but as pointed out, imidicloprid is not the sole reason for bee die off, I really don't think they completely understand what is happening.

Renee

The problems with bees is being balmed on pesticide use, a virus, a mite and the fact that mono-crop plantings do not offer a varied diet to help maintain a healthy immune system. All these things are contributors but the fact still remains that Imidacloprid is highly toxic to bees and as little as 1.5 parts per billion is enough to kill.

Renee I agree that knowing about the product is half the battle, you can't know you are using this product safely without reading about it's affects. Still this is much safer than older pesticides which RFG pointed out. I remember talking to a older orchid grower who was talking about all the health problems and chemical sensitivities they attribute to using some of these older (now banned) chemicals and it's scary. Imidacloprid is relatively safe for people if used properly.

Mike

Here is a link that might be useful: Understanding the Science

I have learned from a bee keeper that pesticides are the least problems on their minds. Yes, there's a big scare for pesticides, but what scare bee keepers the most is that so many crops out there are GMO's and they blame GMO's for the bee demise (GMO=Genetic Modified Organism). Almost all production of soy in the US, Africa, SA, Europe and parts of Asia are all GMO soy. The most infamous by product of the DuPont and Monsato developers is the glyphosate resistant clones of spy, corn, sunflowers, etc. Imagine growing Monsato soy beans n a field along woth weed seeds and other pests. The soy actually produces growth along wth feeding neighboring weeds with their legume affixed root nodules. Now Monsato has developed crops that you can spray Round Up and it will EVERYTHING except for the Monsato soy beans. You don't have to be a chemist or work for NASA to know that if Round Up doesn't kill the soy, it means that the soy has Round Up in it's system. Thus nectar, and the beans themselves are contaminated with the glyphosate.
But you know what, you see solid shelves of Round Up on the garden shelves everywhere that we must already be immune to Round Up too! I have never used Round Up, but people get all worried about a systemic targeted to kill sucking pests in a potted enclosed environment. I'm not worried.
Bee demise has been associated with so many other issues of vegetable and fruit varieties that are seedless and do not require pollination, and in fact don't want their crops pollinated. Bees are themselves alienated from crops as a whole. Only natural fields, clover, wild flowers and areas untouched by man has scored bees in great numbers. Besides would you want to consume honey made from GMO plant products?

There are also now Round-Up resistant super weeds that are causing some serious problems. Monsanto is currently considering selling the chemical that was nicknamed Agent Orange and used in Vietnam to be sprayed to help kill the super weeds they created. There is an entire slew of freighting occurrences that have been the product of Monsanto and the documentary The World According to Monsanto is a good source of information. I truly hope that the Millions Against Monsanto protests are successful because this company is not out to feed the world (what a joke!) they, just like all other corporations are only trying to fill their pockets.
On the GMO front it has been seen that the genetically modified material is capable of being passed from bacteria to bacteria and that the bacteria can incorporate this (resistance etc) into their own DNA.
Europe and some Asain countries have far fewer GMO containing products but North and South America are full of them. If you eat anything with corn, grains or Soy you are eating GMO crops which have not been tested for safety. It's funny that new drugs take years of testing before they ever even make it to human trails but GMO food went right from the lab to the plate with little understanding of the consequences.

Mike

Here is a link that might be useful: Attack of the Super Weed

From what I've read, massive-scale bee-farming is the primary cause of weakened colonies
and, thus, population. There is also a lack of baseline data, and so we don't really know how
much or how little the populations have dropped, fluctuated, or migrated elsewhere.

There's a good deal of misinformation out there, most of it connected to various
Ideological causes du jour.

Josh