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jdmm_gw

growing hydroponic trees

jdmm
15 years ago

I have found very few resources for growing hydroponic trees. I would like to ideally grow tropical and subtropical trees including avocado, Orange, and theodora cacao in northern Ohio. I would be bringing the trees inside during the winter. (Currently I have 3.5 year old avocados growing in pots with dirt and cacao seedlings in dirt.) These trees seem to all prefer well draining soil, so I think expanded clay pebbles would work for these trees. For the avocado and orange, I would probably be ordering new trees in a dwarf cultivars for this system, but for avocado, I need both sex types.

my questions:

expanded clay pebbles are good for the growth medium in 5 gallon buckets, right? I need a dense enough medium to support a tree. I will probably also have to stake the trees.

what type of system do I want? I thought I wanted Ebb and flow, but I did read about people using drip on the rootballs of trees. And because there is very little information about growing trees, where would I find an appropriate watering schedule to start with?

When I get my trees, do I just wash off the soil and plant them in the clay pebbles? trees are larger than most typical hydroponic plants, so it may be more complicated than this.

nutrients and PH? any suggestions?

The cacao will probably be considerably difficult. I will probably wait for my seedlings to grow some time longer and clone the healthiest one. these live in a nutrient poor soil, so I don't suspect they will be that picky about nutrients, so long as they don't get very much.

Comments (9)

  • grizzman
    15 years ago

    how big will the trees get? I saw a banana tree growing in a 30 gallon bucket at a hydro store in Raliegh once. If your tree is bigger than say 4 feet tall, i doubt a 5 gallon bucket will be large enough. I would use a 30-50 gallon trash can. and be sure to install a way to drain it. that hydro store was about to kill off their tree because they had no way to drain out the old mutrients.
    I would buy a large net pot. maybe 8" diameter and fill that with some expanded clay or lava rocks and let the root grow out of that and into the trashcan. no need to fill up so much space with media. the roots need room too.
    I would probably go with EnF or DWC. preferably DWC as it doesn't require any kind of timed watering schedule.
    From this site I'd go with something in the 6.0pH range and the 20cf range. Then take careful notes and adjust as necessary. also, you might want to invest in a small nutrient sampling kit so you can test some before and after nutrient to see what the plants are using more or less of.
    Generally you'll just wash them off and stick them in the media, though most people will tell you to rinse them in some H2O2 to kill off any possible soil borne diseases.
    Keep us informed of your success.
    Good growing!

  • greystoke
    15 years ago

    I've been trying to grow lemon trees hydroponically.
    The problem seems to be the µS-range. The moment I get to ±1100µS, growth stops. Then I wash with plain water, and hey! . . the tree grows again.
    I'm now at ±750µS, ph6.0 to see what happens.

  • plantboy_grower
    15 years ago

    General Hydroponics has a system made for trees, if you want to buy something like that:

    http://www.generalhydroponics.com/genhydro_US/megafarm.html

    I'm sure there is probably a way to make that also. Try to keep it light tight. (not sure if that shade of plastic used on the megafarm is light tight or not, esp. in sunlight.)

  • tclynx
    15 years ago

    Trees can be grown in Hydro. The things you will need to take into account are that the trees will need to get big enough to produce within whatever type of system you use and you are talking about moving said system back and forth.

    How are you going to be moving this system/trees? Even dwarfs can get big enough to be difficult to move. Any media that is going to be heavy enough to support the tree as it gets bigger is going to be heavy to move.

    Reducing the amount of media in the container might help on weight but it won't give much support to the tree as it gets bigger. Lighter medias like perlite or even the expanded clay are great for moving around but also the lighter the media, the less support it will provide.

    I would probably vote for flood and drain since constant drip may have issues over the long term with clogging and build up as well as algae growing.

    If you have a way to let the trees stay in one place and protect them from the cold yet allow them enough light, you will probably have better luck.

    In the short term the trees will probably do ok in a small container but each time you need to transplant, you will be setting your tree back some.

  • oakleaf33
    15 years ago

    J.D.M.M I have started growing some trees such as dogwoods myself..Since I started working at lowes U learn a lot. If your gonna take the rootball or "bulb" and plant it hydorponically. Make sure u remove or just wash off all of the dirt around your roots before u put into a pot. Remember the tree will only grow what u allow it mostly. Once the roots start growing around the bottom of the pot the plants growth will eventually slow. So remember "big pot" if possible. Oh and for your growing medium. Trees typically have larger "roottaps" than small plants, so.....if ur gonna use clay pebbles that make for "well drained soil" try adding a little perlite or vermiculite to you mixture. It will make your medium a little more compact for sturdy foundation. It will also still drain water just not as much. Remember the number one thing that u can do wrong is let the roots dry out no matter what kind of system you are using.

  • jdmm
    Original Author
    15 years ago

    I got in brief contact with a horticulturalist at The Lands at Disney. The trees there are grown in sand with subsurface drip irrigation.

    As much as I want to do flood and drain, I think the eventual size of the bucket when the plants are mature will exclude this method. So I am thinking of growing in expanded clay with a perlite mixed in for moisture control. I may also use a course coconut fiber near the top, but I don't want to use too much because in a large pot it will likely retain too much moisture and salts. I'll put a layer gravel in the bottom for added weight and drainage. I am thinking of trying drip irrigation.

    I have recently learned that Cacao have a wide range of acceptable soil PH (5.0-7.5), so I am not concerned about this anymore.

    Cacao is listed in The "World Fertilizer Use Manual." (http://www.fertilizer.org/ifa/publicat/html/pubman/cacao.htm)
    If I use the Nutrient demand/uptake/removal information for nursery age trees and scale the ratio of uptake into a solution that falls into an acceptable PPM level, I get the following nutrient values:

    in ppm (mg atom / L solution)
    N 187 (of which 90% is in nitrate form)
    P 42
    K 169
    S 93
    Fe 95
    Mn 2.27
    Zn .60
    Cu .19
    B .51
    Mg 70
    Ca 153
    Cl .06
    Mo .05
    (This is NPK 8.3 - 4.3 - 9.1)

    Cacao is a Zone 11 tree, and I am trying to grow it in 5. That is what makes this fun.

    My Avocados in pots with soil are doing well. They are around 6 feet now and I tood them outside a few days ago. To my supprise, they are happy all the way down to around 38°F then I have bring them inside.

  • garyfla_gw
    15 years ago

    Hi
    Was curious as to why Cocoa?? Not enough problems with regular culture?? lol I grew one for several years in a pot in the shadehouse. Pickiest plant I've ever seen. Would nose dive at 50 degrees ,too much light too little would slow it way down.too little or too much humidity Grew it for over 8 years and never got a pod lol.
    Finally croaked after a rain storm ,have no idea why.
    Good luck !!! gary

  • bntbrl
    15 years ago

    I have been thinking about growing trees also hydroponically. I am not sure but I have a couple theories I want to try. When doing bonsai the root ball is set on a square vynil tile to keep it shallow, if there is a tap root a slot is cut in the tile and a hole made to allow the majority of the rootball to stay above the tile. The tap root continues to go down. After the rootball had sufficient feeder roots the tap root can be removed from many trees making the rootball more compact. I would like to tryt this to keep the container size down.

    I think the post above about the roots growing out of the pot stops the growth is a little out with hydro I think. One, the roots will stop growing from a pot when they reach air, and the tre will stop growing when it is root bound in the pot. There is no more room left for roots so it cant grow.

    I havent made up my mind what I want to try to grow first but soon will.

    Please keep us updated on this one.

  • garyfla_gw
    15 years ago

    Hi
    I grow several tropical trees in water culture mostly to limit the growth. i use them as live supports for epiphytes. Ficus trees will respond by forming aerial roots
    and eventually produce stilt roots lifting the base above the water. Have a F. benjamina that has been growing in a bucket of water since 1982. it has outlasted 4 buckets lol.
    it responded to the instability by growing roots into the fence and has also formed a distince buttress system
    Amazing what abuse a plant will tolerate !!! lol
    gary

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