If it were me, I'd do a little more research before taking the plunge. Aeroponics is fraught with difficulties for a newbie. It's fun, but has more than its fair share of obstacles.

DO NOT try growing everything together; won't work. As far as grow lights, this being your first experience, try using sunlight; it's way easier. A pH measuring tool (meter or tape) is essential, as well as an EC meter and yes, both are pricey. As for nutrients, start with something simple.

Get something growing that isn't going to take you hours and hours each day; get your feet wet, then branch out and try something exotic.

thanks for the response freemangreens. I found this online,
http://www.labdepotinc.com/Product_Details~id~0~pid~12676.aspx - could it be a useful tool?

So if i had a 6 pot tote I'd have to do 6 tomatoes or 6 peppers? something like that?

What kinds of difficulties arise with an aeroponic setup?

Are other systems purely personal preference?

If i dont have 12 hours of good sunlight in a window, are hydroponics extremely difficult to work with?

Aeroponics, as generally practiced, has a high-pressure pump piped to a high-pressure sprayer.

High pressure pumps are expensive, they require pressure piping, they are noisy, they require expensive controls and they are prone to failure.

High pressure drop emitters get dirty very easily, plug up, make noise and stop spraying.

There are other ways to do aero, but most commercial systems you will see on the web are the above system.

Keith Roberto's book is indeed a good read.

I built a similar aeroponic system as detailed, I have had nothing but good results from it. I've done a variety of hydro methods, I will say that this is my favourite - and it's inexpensive.

Don't worry about CO2 injection, that's advanced. Your plants will grow very happily without it.

Lights - it is beneficial to have two types for growing fruiting plants (tomatoes, peppers etc). If you just want to start with the basics, grow some simple lettuce to get the feel for things, you only need a vegetative (blue) light then.

Nutrients - They will last a long time. My personal choice is a 3-part nutrient, a bit more complex than a singular nutrient but more adaptable.

I recommend you read all you can, and then some more. Get a good feel for how everything works, you will then avoid plant disasters and get the crops you really want.

peat 0, would you mind giving me some of your system details? or did you pretty much follows Roberto's aero system specs?

willard, all the specs i've seen online have been for nothing but inexpensive parts.

RE "thanks for the response freemangreens. I found this online,
http://www.labdepotinc.com/Product_Details~id~0~pid~12676.aspx - could it be a useful tool?"

Heck, I'd throw 20 bucks at it just for fun. If it works; great. If it's a hoax, think of it as a few missed trips to Starbucks!

the meter you linked to might be okay, but for the $130 you'd be spending, I would personally buy a truncheon EC meter and stick with inexpensive test strips until I could buy a pH meter.(notice the $20 price tag was a "from" price and was actually just the calibration solution)
True aero systems are as willard describes. the high pressure equipment is required to get very fine water mist on the plants. most of the low pressure "aero" systems just squirt water on the roots. with the low pressure systems, you'll need longer off cycles on your timer to allow the roots to dry a bit and get some air and you'll have more dead roots. Not that this is a problem and I'm sure you'll grow wonderful plants. But you should be aware there is a difference. In past years I've used a modified low pressure aero hydrid with tremendous success.

well i'd love to get some tomatoes and peppers off whatever system i end up going with.

The aero systems i've seen are mostly referencing a 360 GPH Submersible Pump that runs about $25 and a few micro sprayers. Is this considered high pressure?

Is the system you're referring to of actually squirting water mostly used in circular containers b/c you have to wrap the tubing around the tote? Would a DWC be more effective?

dmatukian,

I pretty much followed the original design. What was different was that I used the rotating sprinklers, rather than the static spray type.

The GPH of my pump was 176, this provides more than enough for my six sprayers. I have a 'T' bar which is not fixed as per the design, this allows me to have it at any height. I've also put an air stone in the bottom to aid aeration.

Keith's design is part aero and part DWC due to the water being contained in the bottom of the tank. If the aero system fails, then you will still be able to grow using the DWC part - only if your roots are long enough to reach into the water though.

OK, it's not 'true' aero in the sense that the water droplets are too large. However, it does work, and works very well.

I agree it works very well. It was my primary system for many years.
Here is a link to a very simple and very small home build I posted last year. Same technique, slightly different design.
I have, however, had problems with root rot when I ran the system 24/7. Nothing that killed the plant, but it was there.

The picture below is my system last year using the exact same principle. I would only run the pump about 30 minutes every 1.1/2 hours and the roots were crystalline white.
{{gwi:1004484}}

thanks for the info so far guys. all very helpful.

I've been reading about these autopots. Is this a practical application for a small home use application?

I know you have to get the Smart-Valve, do also have to purchase the modules?

I don't know about starting with aeroponics. It's a bit more advanced in the hydroponics types, and is a bit more complex.

I use DWC buckets. 3 and 4 gallon buckets with an air line run into them with an air stone, attached to an air pump. I've had the most unusual growth rate with a Mr. Stripey tomato clone. Three days ago, I went to sleep after checking my day-2 transplant clone, no roots showing out anywhere. I sleep for nine hours, wake up, have coffee, check the net pot again, and I have 4-5 inch roots in many places. It's day three of roots showing, and they are almost a foot in length, if not more.

Just an idea: Has anyone ever tried using a "vaporizer" to propel hydro mist onto roots? I suppose recycling the liquid could be a nightmare, but it'd be a very fine mist application.

in a DWC systen. does the water level typically have to be like 1-2 inches right below the net pot to support the roots?

I like the idea of a DWC/AERO hybrid application so if the level drops a bit you still have significant coverage by the sprayers.

What is better, pin sprayers or micro sprayers?

HydroTheoretical, what is more advanced about Aero? is it just the setup you're speaking about that is more advanced?

In DWC, you start it off with the water just below the net pots, your airstone, as the bubbles burst on the surface, splash the clay pebbles (or whatever you use) with nutrient rich water.

Once the roots start growing into the water, start to drop the level. This allows air roots to form which are beneficial, at no point have the roots out of the water.

Pin sprayers or micro sprayers? I read that pin sprayers were more prone to block, and that the rotating ones were less so. They are in constant motion which supposedly helps.

Why is Aero more advanced? Simply because of the greater amounts of oxygen it delivers at the rootball; roots want oxygen, the propelled water absorbs oxygen and delivers it straight to the roots.

Basic aero is not that much more technically advanced over other systems, the setup you have seen is very simple to build; and not much more work than a DWC system to maintain.

I'm a big convert to this aero/DWC system, and won't be going back to just DWC anymore :-)

peat 0, i think you've just about sold me.

question about a default Hydro Planter setup. Using some air stones and filling the entire planter with a medium... is this not a good system? just curious :)

DWC is the beginner system. Nearly impossible to screw up, and when failures do occur there's generally no catastrophic destruction of plants or property.

If they're built well there's no chance for leaking, and if the air pump fails there's still a good many hours before damage occurs to the plant.

With aeroponics the pressurized water leaves a better chance for leaks and a complete evacuation of the reservoir into the local environment (ie, your house, greenhouse, etc). There's enough to learn in hydroponics without adding complications.

and with DWC what is the water level standard? directly below the net pot until root growth and than gradually lowering the water level as the roots grow?

hooked on ponics,

The system we are talking here is non-pressurized. It's contained in your standard rubbermaid type container; if it's waterproof, it's waterproof - it won't suddenly deposit it's contents on your floor.

It's not a complicated system, remember, it incorporates aero and DWC.

peat 0, i've come across many references online that mention if doing a purely DWC system to always keep the nutrient level an inch above the bottom of the net pots.

but people have said after the roots get going the nutrient level doesnt need to be so high.

any definitive answers?

The way I do it is to drop the water level when the roots are fully in the water. I probably have 1/4 of the container as 'air space', the other 3/4 as water.

To be honest, both ways will work (although I haven't done the other one).

Let's put the question to the floor - which way does everyone on here do DWC?

Actually Peat0, my hydro bucket I posted a picture of above did have leakage problems although the trash can is water proof. the problem is the seal between the top and bottom is not waterproof. I used a rubber sealant around the thing. It was not a catostraphic leak, but until the root system was big enough to keep the water from hitting the sides, it did leak all the time. 5 gallon buckets don't have that problem as they have a water tight seal at that point.
as for vaporizing, I read a page where someone had done it using an ultrasonic vaporizer. the problems were keeping the mist from escaping and failure of the vaporizer (apparently the nutrients had a tendency to gum things up)

grizzman, I know exactly where you are coming from here, until I put some rubber door seal around my lid, that leaked!

It's amazing how water will find even the smallest gap to escape from. You think you have made it waterproof, turn it on, and find a small trickle running down...

Peat o. I'm new too all this like a few others on this thread. What is the DWC/areo set up you are talking about. I'm about five weeks on on my first grow with a home made 14 gallon tote having six net pots. Progress seems good(though i have no other grows to compare), but i like the sound of the areo stuff. would you mind explaining more about that hybrid system?
Thanks

All the design information is in a book called 'How to Hydroponics' by Keith Roberto. It's a great little book with lots of good information and designs which you can build yourself.

Very briefly: Take your basic DWC system, net pots, air stone etc. Add a water pump in the bottom, from the water pump run some plastic tubing up vertically into a 'T' piece. Two pieces of plastic tubing extend out either side, seal the ends with stoppers. Drill some holes in the top tubing and screw some misters in.

Adjust the spray bar so it's just spraying the bottom of the net pots. Your water level stays low, enough to cover the water pump so it won't run dry.

There are a number of very similar builds on the internet, this is one which will give you a better idea: http://projects.greenmangardens.net/content/view/25/39/

Mine differs in that I only have six 3" netpots and my sprayers are on that 'T' bar.

Peat O, Thanks for the info i will chack it out. do you still run the sprayers once the roots have reached the solution?

are these spayers a bad idea for organic nutes?

I'm using the pura vida line from techna flora.

I run mine 24/7, no problems so far with root rot - they remain white and healthy. Some people cycle the spraying, I don't have a timer that does this so left them on all the time.

I've not had any personal experience with organic nutes, I use the General Hydroponics 3-part Flora series. I have read though, that organic nutes are not a good idea for aero as they clog things!

One more thing, it's a good idea to have a water pump with a filter, or, surround it will an aquarium mesh bag. You don't want bits of broken roots clogging the system.

Thanks again, i'll be looking into making one of these.

Dmatukian- didnt mean to steal your post and be the one to ask instead of giving info. hoped my question helped you!

how dare you kylle!!

Just kidding. its all good. this is a beginners post so any info related is useful you, me, and anyone else.

Kylle. for filters, i've seen this one recommended before. you connect tubing on both sides on the way to the sprayers.

peat 0 and others. i'm looking to just do a small herb setup first to get my feet wet so i'd like a small(er) tote with 4-6 net pots. these are the 2 totes i'm looking at. might just do DWC. are there certain specifications for totes that need to be considered?

Rubbermaid 3 Gallon Tote.

Rubbermaid 10 Gallon Tote.

Rubbermaid Simplifile Tote.

My personal preference is for a deeper rather than wider/shallower tote - plenty of room for the roots to spread down.

Also, the bigger the tote capacity the more stable the nutrients will be in regards pH fluctuations. The pH will fluctuate during the grow, but will take longer in comparison to a much smaller unit.

If you are going to keep this as a hobby, then I would buy the biggest one you can afford - you will then have the capacity to grow much bigger plants later on eg tomatoes.

If you are just doing a small herb setup, then the 10 gallon one looks very shallow (no dimensions) but the simplifile depth looks OK at 11", but it does not say the capacity...

Keep in mind also the width of the unit, you need to encompass all your net pots and space them so they are not too close - give your plants room to spread out.

The book I quoted uses this one: http://www.rubbermaid.com/rubbermaid/product/product.jhtml?prodId=HPProd2940118

The one I bought was similar but only 10 gallon capacity. It's done a great job with growing lettuce, looseleaf and butterhead. I've started tomatoes so will see how this pans out.

well even if i stick with things i would always want a separate tote for just herbs

ok. I checked out the 10 gallon Roughneck tote at Lowes today. Just out of curiosity i picked the container up and held it up to the light. There is def light visible on the other side of the cover and the tote. This is a rubbermaid Roughneck. I this ok in terms of bacteria???

I bought the 14 gallon tote at lowes. They had a blue one and a tan one. Well, I bought the tan, should of went with the blue. I had to end up buying a roll of foil tape and wrapped the whole thing. I also chang my nutes every 5-6 days, so for me light getting through has not been a prob.

kylle221, i saw both those totes tonight!

anyone know if the color of tubing for the Sprayers or for the water indicator matter? Lowes only really has clear poly tubing that has no color.

the guy at our local hydro store told me to get the dark toobing for my drip system ( i built the one on stealth hydros website for half the price, but after the roots hit the nutes i took the pump out). He said the dark tubing would keep the alge from growing in them. I went with the clear so i could see what was going on insde of the tubing?

There was is web page that shows how to build a bubble bucket that used clear toobing for the water indicator. very simple set up, i'm going to build one this weekend. here is the site.

http://forum.grasscity.com/general-indoor-growing/121335-lets-build-bubble-bucket-step-step.html

im going to need a ph tester at some point and ec tester. are any of these worth getting. inexpensive yes.

ph Tester

ph Tester2

ec Tester

ec Tester2

or would something like this be more practical.

pH liquid Tester

For a hydroponics system, get a liquid pH indicator. It's cheaper, requires no calibration, and you don't have to worry about probes going bad.

I don't use EC or PPM meters. I keep careful watch when I add nutrients. That's just me, though. I've been doing this long enough to wing it by feel.

hydrotheoretical, but i've read that when it comes to feeding the plants they arent always taking 100% of the nutrient that sometimes its just nutrients. so over a period of time the nutrient concentration is increasing since the plant is using all of it

From my understanding (correct me if i'm wrong) the plants will sometimes drink more water than nutrient. So as your water is being used faster than nutrient, the ppm will rise.

kylle221 your understanding is correct about water consumption. many plants show obvious signs of too much fertilizer (most commonly tip burn or leaf curl) and after some time you learn to recognize the signs and can adjust on the fly. Also there are many rules of thumb about adding water to nutrient for "x" amount of time, then switching out the hole batch.

As far as the black tubing goes, they carry it at lowes. it's usually below the rainbird brand water system supplies. about $15USD for 50 feet. personally, I don't like it because it is not flexible. I prefer the nylon hose. if algae is too much of a problem, you can always add peroxide or bleach to the solution to control it. I believe 6 ppm was the recommended bleach concentration.

also of note, if you're wanting to cover your tote with aluminum foil to block out light, try using aluminum foil. (from the grocery) you can buy spray-on adhesive at a craft store to get it to easily stick to the tub. that should be considerable less expensive than the aluminum HVAC tape.

For your black tubing you could find 100 feet of it at an aquarium shop for $12.

I've used plastidip spray to light-proof buckets, plus it gives them a bit of extra grip if you don't have handles.

dmatukian: PPM rises when water is used faster than nutrients. Usually I just add water to a nutrient solution in the DWC and change my basil solution every two weeks, tomato weekly.

hydrotheoretical, you mean you change out all the nutrient solution?

Actually Peat0, my hydro bucket I posted a picture of above did have leakage problems although the trash can is water proof. the problem is the seal between the top and bottom is not waterproof.

That's what I was talking about when I said that high-pressure systems (which all aeroponic systems are, without exception) and leaks. Just because you put all the pumps, pipes, and sprayers inside a rubbermaid or trashcan or whatever doesn't make it waterproof.

Most systems at least have the capability of leaking past the lid and even if they don't normally there's the possibility that, should a sprayer, joint, or other part of the system fail just right, the new configuration would leak. Imagine if instead of a fine spray something happens that results in a single condensed jet of water aimed right at the edge of the lid. You'll probably get a leak that way.

The point isn't that certain aeroponic systems are more or less prone to leaking, it's that anytime you pressurize water enough to move it from one place to another you increase the risks of it moving in a direction or place you don't really want it to.

That's why I advised starting with a simple DWC where unless you get a physical failure of the reservoir (rupture) you don't have to worry about water going places it doesn't belong.

so as a given rule should you clean out your entire nute solution every 2 weeks?

hooked on ponics, you got an email or AIM i can reach you at?

if anyone ever wants to reach me on AIM my name is dmatukian

im a big fan of IRC but perhaps AIM is a bit easier. hell even a facebook community page would be nice.

The only pictures that were posted above were by grizzman & hydrotheoretical. Are you using two logon names?

I know exactly what you are saying here, but if you waterproof well - it won't leak.

The container I use has locking handles, they pull the whole lid down; tight. Yes, it did leak (a little) to start with, but I sealed it with window seal and bathroom sealant. I was very concerned about water leaks, I trialled, tested and messed around with all sorts of jets hitting the side and top - it's waterproof, I could not get any leak out of it.

I feel confident that whatever happens inside to the pipes, jets etc that it will stay sealed and not leak on me. It all depends on the design of your lid and what efforts you adopt to make it watertight.

I agree with your assumption that DWC is much simpler to start out with, it depends on what lengths damatukian wants to go to and what his technical build ability is.

After running my system, I would not go back to normal DWC now - in my eyes, this grows better :-)

peat 0, you got ane mail i can contact you at?