Linnea, I answered this first on your thread in the Veggie Forum. For the benefit of those here, I will re-post:

SSE carries a "Gold of Bacau" Romano-type wax. Henry Fields, Vermont Bean & Sand Hill Preservation carry "Kentucky Wonder Wax". Pinetree carries "Yellow Romano Burro D' Ingegnoli", a pole Romano variety. Johnny's carries "Marvel of Venice", another Romano-type.

A source for "Goldmarie" (another pole Romano-type) is in the link below.

These are just what I found browsing my catalogs, so I'm sure there are quite a few others.

Here is a link that might be useful: Goldmarie source

Thanks again, Zeedman! Now that I know where is a bean forum, I will check here too. I learned a lot surfing this forum last night after reading your Vegetable gardening post.

Wind chill 11 below today, and I'm dreaming of next year's wax beans ripening in the summer sun...with those heirloom tomatoes I'm going to be ordering too (I never knew you could order transplants too?!).

Zeedman, thanks for posting it here too... When I saw that Burro D'Ingegnoli was available again, I couldn't believe my good luck. It is my all-time favorite bean. But....when I searched pinetree's site, it wasn't there.

I called and was told that Pinetree is not selling "Yellow Romano Burro D' Ingegnoli;" they have a yellow pole bean called Marengo Romano, (catalog page 30), but it is white-seeded.

I used to grow "Yellow Romano Burro D' Ingegnoli," (from Pinetree), and it was brown-seeded and the finest bean I ever tasted, par excellence.

It is a great loss that "Burro D' Ingegnoli" is no longer available. For Gardenlad, Tobacco Worm is the bean against which (he says) he judges all other beans, for me it is "Yellow Romano Burro D' Ingegnoli;" the most delicious, buttery, tender, beautiful bean IÂve come across. If it was still available, IÂd be growing none other.

That idiotic European seed registry has had a devastating effect on garden varieties.... Grrrrr

So sorry I didn't save seeds.....

I found Burro D' Ingegnoli for sale on eBay. I traded seeds with Alain a couple of years ago when he was posting on GW. He is friendly and reliable. He is not one of the rip-off artists who sometimes sell garden seeds on eBay. He's a serious gardener, bean collector and a member of SSE (or was).

BTW, he describes Burro D' Ingegnoli as a white seeded dwarf (bush). And all other references to it I found call it a dwarf bean, the European nomenclature for bush bean. It's flavor is raved about in every description of it. I may need to grow this one. :-)

Jim

Here is a link that might be useful: Alain Letroye's eBay Store

"That idiotic European seed registry has had a devastating effect on garden varieties...."

Marquette, you have no idea. The restrictions implemented by the European Union, and the underfunding or collapse of many seed banks in the former Soviet Union & its satellites, threaten thousands of traditional vegetable cultivars. That is one of several reasons that I am active in the Seed Savers Exchange, and why I fight against efforts to create similar plant restrictions in this country. Too many varieties have already been lost forever.

Think about how wonderful "Burro D' Ingegnoli" is, and consider how many equally wonderful vegetables are poised on the brink of extinction. It is both sad & ironic that for many European vegetables, American seed savers may represent the final safety net before extinction.

Fortunately, at present, small quantities of seed can be sent by mail from most countries with minimal difficulty. There are exceptions, and regulations, and those intending to do so should do some research... but it is a wonderful opportunity. So if you still have family outside the country, it might be worthwhile to obtain seed from them. Don't wait too long though... efforts are already underway to completely prohibit the private importation of seed into the U.S., which will close that window forever.

FYI, most of the pole wax beans that are still available are European in origin.

Pardon my rant... it makes me angry too. Grrrrrrrrr.

Jimster, thanks for the link, but unfortunately, the Burro D'Ingegnoli on Alain's site is a bush bean with round pods.

The Burro D'Ingegnoli I grew was a broad, yellow Romano pole bean with brown seeds. The pods were not all that long, say 5-6 inches. I bought my seeds from Pinetree in, say, 2001 or thereabout. I know it was brown-seeded, because I had thirty seeds left over (and still have a dozen or so in storage, but they are probably not viable). I tried germinating some in several batches last year, but they didn't take.

I have a photo of Burro D'Ingegnoli on my computer's desktop. It's a good picture showing the bright yellow color correctly (no green ends, which is how the pods grew/showed on the vine), plus yellow (w/white?) flowers, and pod size. I don't know how to post pics to GW, since I don't have the pic's url.

Zeedman, I'll respond later..... Unfortunately, I don't speak or write Italian, but I think there is a small movement of non-profit/foundations in Europe that are beginning to save seeds. But much too late. It is so sad, this mindless destruction of hundreds of years' worth of growing and selecting.

I suspect the destructive seed registry is connected to the huge global seed industry wishing to control seed production and eliminating competition. I guess their dream is a world of hybrids, so farmers and gardeners would be in their hands, much like we are in the hands of the oil industry for transportation. Will I get a warning for behavior not becoming a GW poster for saying these things? Uggggg

I'm afraid, there are similarly destructive movements in the poultry industry; I'm thinking chickens here. It is freightening.

Can add thart if Graines Beaumaux sells to USA they have a very large selection of vegetable seeds. My french is not so good that I can find that type of information on their hompage. It´s a very good company and they sell on mailorder and it´s not that difficult to fill in the order form even if you dont speak french. I have their wonderful catalog at home, very thick and lots of pictures.

Here is a link that might be useful: Graines Beaumaux

I took a quick look at the Graines Beaumaux site. For those who want to look but have no french, beans are called haricots. Haricots beurre (butter beans) are apparently what they call wax beans. (Not like what we call butter beans, a type of lima bean) San fils means stringless. Jaune is yellow. They do mention the color of the seed (grain): brun=brown, noir=black, black=white. "à utiliser en frais, conserves et congélation" means "may be used fresh, canned or frozen".

I recognized some types that we have here too, but couldn't see any designation for pole vs. bush. I couldn't find info on shipping to the US either.

You find the pole varieties under Haricots/Ramants Mangetout there you find varieties like Neckargold and Goldmarie.

I grew Gold Marie last year (from Seeds of Change, w/excellent germination rate), and though it was no Burro D'Ingegnoli in taste or beauty, it was a nice tender bean, no strings, white seeds.

Gold Marie seeds are available from Seeds of Change and from many other seed houses. I googled "gold marie bean" and voilà , a whole slew of options for Gold Marie seed popped up. Long live the internet!

http://www.seedsofchange.com/garden_center/product_details.asp?item_no=S14128
I like the growing information on SoC's web site at each variety. Helpful people, fast service, good experience
http://www.localharvest.org/store/item.jsp?id=7568
http://www.gourmetseed.com/snap_bean_seed.0.html
http://www.prseeds.ca/catalogue/beans.php?C=Beans
http://www.saltspringseeds.com/catalog/index.cfm?categoryid=20
http://www.linnaeafarm.org/cgi-bin/farm/show_sitemap_article.cgi?ID=28
scroll down to Gold Marie

PS How would I get those urls to convert to links?

marquette

You wrote:
It is a great loss that "Burro D' Ingegnoli" is no longer available. For Gardenlad, Tobacco Worm is the bean against which (he says) he judges all other beans, for me it is "Yellow Romano Burro D' Ingegnoli;" the most delicious, buttery, tender, beautiful bean IÂve come across. If it was still available, IÂd be growing none other.

That idiotic European seed registry has had a devastating effect on garden varieties.... Grrrrr

(snip)

This is quite wrong. The Ingegnoli seed company is one of the largest in Italy and their Burro d'Ingegnoli beans are commercially available.

I am adding the url of their catalogue. Type 'burro' in the Cerca window and the beans will pop up.

You also wrote:
..... but I think there is a small movement of non-profit/foundations in Europe that are beginning to save seeds. But much too late (snip)

This is not at all what is happening. Pro Spezie Rara, for example, is celebrating their 25th anniversary, with Arche Noah and many other European foundations saving seeds for a similar length of time. There is much mis-information around about seed-saving outside of SSE and the USA.

Here is a link that might be useful: Ingegnoli Seeds

Two more interesting and rare yellow bean varieties, both wide podded, dark seeded and tall growing. Juliskabab, a Hungarian variety, see url below.

Secondly Marvel of Venice from Harvest Moon - dark seeded and different from the white seeded Marvel of Venice mentioned above.

Here is a link that might be useful: Juliskabab

Galina, the English version of the Ingegnoli site is inoperational at present, and my Italian is very limited... do you know if they will ship to the U.S.?

I know that for some time, the restrictive phyto-sanitary requirements discouraged many Continental seed companies (and even some Canadian companies) from shipping here. As you have stated, the information we have in the U.S. is not always current. I know that the regulations for entry of seeds to the U.S. have relaxed somewhat recently (although there are signs that this is only temporary).

To your knowledge, are there many European seed companies that will ship here by mail? If you could name any - even just those you know of in the U.K. - it would be of great help to many U.S. gardeners here on GW.

Thank you for the listing of additional European seed saving organizations. As a member of SSE, I freely acknowledge that they tend to think of themselves as the center of the seed-saving universe [grinning sheepishly]. While there may be some degree of legitimacy to that claim (based upon the many similar organizations that they have inspired worldwide) they are certainly not the only player on the field, and perhaps not even the first. Just the 500-pound gorilla in the room - for better or worse. ;-) Thanks for setting the record straight.

On the Ingegnoli site, I could find shipping info only for Europe. And the Burro D' Ingegnoli bean they list is the bush bean, not the pole Romano type.

Jim

zeedman

my Italian is non-existent, but if you click on 'Informazione' on the link I have sent, a contact email address will pop up. And almost all Europeans speak English.

It is often not obvious whether or not any given seed company will send to the USA, and whether they will do so in the future. Easiest to just ask them as and when somebody wants to order.

I was able to find "FAGIOLO RAMPICANTE - MERAVIGLIA DI VENEZIA - A GRANO NERO" (Marvel of Venice, Black Seed) and "FAGIOLO RAMPICANTE - MARENGO- (a grano bianco)" (Marengo, White Seed) on the Italian site. However, I couldn't find Burro D'Ingegnoli", so it is probably safe to say that it is no longer commercially available. I will send an email to Pine Tree Seeds to see if they might carry it again.