i'll jump in and agree. while i am not a master gardener, I did take every available hortuculture class in highschool, worked a summer job at a nursery, did independant work by reading books and gardening in my parents yard, went to college and majored in ornamental horticulture, and continue my learning to this day through my own hobby gardens, and interacting with outhers on this site. i would not say i am a "master" of gardening. and i feel that anyone who took a few hours of classes and did some volunteer work probably is not a "master" either. most MG's i have met are nice and humble, but some are a few who unfortunatly stand out in my mind who are far to quick to point out that you should listen to them for they are a Master Gardener. i dont know if its the title i have a problem with or the attitude of (an admittedly a VERY few) who posess the title.

before i get flamed. i openly admit that MOST MG's are not like this but the sad truth is that 1-2 bad eggs can spoil the whole dozen.

First off, there was alot to learn. Even though I'd gardened in another state for many years, being able to analyse someone elses problems (I had enough trouble with my own :-) required empathy, interpretation and knowledge. Being able to say "I don't know for sure, but can suggest....." was a lot better than what the average beginner/questioner could do. I "deserved" the title master gardener for all the work I did. I was young and really appreciated my flowery certificate which my girlfriend framed for me. That was long ago and I am now much more than the master gardener I was. The title is only for people that respect such things, but I remember the effort that my instructor went through to help us and I remember my mistakes. It was a surprise that the county I live in did not have the same "energy" for master gardening as there was up north. I even offered to "take up the flag" but I'm not an academic. There should be a national repository for master gardening. So, I went my own way and forgot about it until now. My orchards, gardens, greenhouse and fields flourish with life and food. There is much still to be learned and if I move to another area I know there will always be a garden with its master gardener.

There would be less of a problem if the full term Master Gardener Volunteer was used each and every time. The public doesn't understand the heirarchy of gardening and doesn't place Master Gardeners in the correct position among degreed professionals such as botanists, landscape designers and landscape architects. They equate the term with old-world Masters where one spent a lifetime learning a trade, starting as apprentice, then journeyman and finally , if the Master died they became a Master of their particular profession. Of course me being a Master Gardener I like the term because I am given credit for more than I actually know. As I understand it, here are the stages of a Master Gardener: Intern, Certified Master Gardener, Lifetime Master Gardener, Advanced Master Gardener, and finally, dead Master Gardener. That's where you get a little plaque to go on your tombstone which is surrounded by plastic flowers.

One of the definitions of "master" from Merriam-Webster Dictionary is "a worker or artisan qualified to teach apprentices." That's what the Master Gardener program was established for, to help extension agents teach the public about gardening.

This "title" is absolutely not meant to imply that MGs are "all-knowing gardening gurus" but that they generally have a higher level of knowledge than the AVERAGE home gardener and are skilled in both researching information and imparting that information to those who request it.

With more than forty years experience gardening and seven years as a MG, what I still DON'T know about gardening far outweighs what I DO know. But due to the training I've received I feel qualified to help others with less gardening knowledge than I have and to find answers to their questions when I don't know the answers.

Sandy

Here's a link to the history of the program.

Here is a link that might be useful: The Master Gardener Program, Early History

9 yrs. into it, I still think "Master" Gardener is akin to "Master" plumber, or "Master" electrician, i.e. someone who's worked to gain some specialized knowledge in the trade, can help those people without the training, but is still being supervised. (Correct me if I'm wrong about that definition. I'm not sure about that hierachy -- should we be "journeyman" gardeners?)
In Clay Co., FL, it says on your name tag that you're a Master Gardener Volunteer. Does that help clear up the snootiness issue with those with hort. degrees?

Hello again -- I really just meant this question to be humorous and creative, not to put anyone on the defensive. My point is not about the rigors of training or volunteering, just a philosophical stance regarding the juxtapostion of the terms "master" and "gardener". I personally don't see myself lording over my subjugated garden, but working with nature, and would enjoy a more eco-friendly sobriquet. No offense was intended or implied since I too am a certified MG.

Eddie's point about highlighting the "volunteer" portion of the MGV designation is well-said.

Oh, I get it! You mean you don't consider yourself a garden Master, whip-and-chair gardener! LOL I don't think any of us do. Well, there might be one I can think of who wants to threaten and demand her garden into submission but most don't.

Sorry if I sounded defensive, I didn't mean it that way. I've gotten used to the comments about the label and just try to explain the real meaning of the term. Maybe the name should be revised to reflect the current thinking but what would it be? Somebody will always take offense at whatever we're called. Most people in the "green" industry appreciate what we do and understand our position but there are a few who seem to feel threatened by the moniker. Maybe "The Lowly (Bowing and Scraping) Horticultural Volunteer Assistants to the County Extension Agent" would be inoffensive enough? TLBASHVATTCEA Let'em pronounce that! ;-)

dont get me wrong, i have no problem with master gardeners as a group, but a few bad experiances with individuals. some people let the word "master" go to their head. im not saying i dont appreciate what master gardening is about and the good works they do, im just saying a few hours of training and some volunteer work isnt "mastering" anything. i myself even with a formal education in hortculture would not consider myself a master of gardening as a whole, there are certain areas i concentrated in that i feel i have mastered but even Dr.'s of horticulture are only a master in some area, not in gardening as a whole.

thats my oppinion. im not sayign anyone else has to agree or that anyone elses oppinion is any less valid than mine, thats just how i personally feel about it.

When the MG program was started in the early 70's, they already had master knitters and master canners, so it was a natural step to call the gardeners master gardeners. (I never heard anybody complaining about the knitters and canners being called masters. Hmmm...) Wonder why this subject comes up periodically on these forums? I mean, get a life, people!

As a MG, I have no problem with the title. I have many years of gardening under my belt and most MG's have the same experience - much more than "a few hours of training and volunteering." The MG's in our county don't come into the program as novices - they are already gardeners with years of hands-on experience. It's not a program to learn how to garden - they assume you already know the basics before taking the classes.

Just wanted to set the record straight. Of course, next year the same subject will come up. Sigh....

Well, I agree with everyone who points out that "master" relates to guiding, as an apprentice is guided. I also agree that MG Volunteer helps clarify the position. I think that clients feel more comfortable taking advice from a volunteer rather than the Agent because of the somewhat grandiose name. I have encountered one problematic observation though. Our vet MGV's seem to have a beaurocratic power-mongering approach that is harmful to our program, and I also notice that many of them are retired from autocratic careers like teaching or physicians - I hope that the title doesn't attract people who seek out powerful titles. Hope that doesn't offend anyone. It's just my observation of our group contrasted with other equally active gardening groups to which I belong.

I think that certain attitude would exist no matter what you called the position. And I'd bet my felco pruner that the name will never change. Now, if you'll excuse me, I have to go subjugate some plants.

;-)

As an former extension educator, I taught Master Gardeners. People would often ask me if I was a Master Gardener. Being more of a bugs and diseases guy, I usually joked, "I have a Masters in Gardening, but I am not a Master Gardener."

LOL, leaveswave!

I think I'll start lobbying for master canners and master knitters to be called Master Canner Volunteers and Master Knitter Volunteers. LOL!

I have a friend who took the classes and now calls herself a "Master Gardener". It is simply a nice title, nothing more, nothing less. I have probably forgotten more than she will EVER know about gardening. The comments she comes up with are truly amazing! A true "Master Gardener" is one who through the years has planted, coddled, experimented, and grieved over things that didn't make it, and continues to learn....... every day of their lives!

I too am bothered by the moniker "master" and it's mostly because of the public's perception/expectation that wearing that badge I should know everything. I'm an avid gardener but certainly not a lover of lawns, don't raise food crops, and don't obsess about pests in my garden. Half of the calls I field on the hotline have to do with killing things, not planting and growing them

My husband jokes that since he's a fisherman, he should be called a "master baiter" LOL!!!

To understand the Master Gardners and the hate that they breed in the Green Community, you first have to understand the economic reasons the MG program was created. Once upon a time Cooperative Extension used to pay degreed indiviuals to answer questions, do community out reach and research. Do to buget cuts most of the professionals were fired. To fill the void the mass pool of desperate housewives, empty nesters and elderly were tapped as source of free labor. So to the green industry MG's are like low paid sweat shop laborers in mexico, china or india that produce a low quality yet cheaper product.

Ok, I've "listened" to a lot of criticism of the Master Gardener program and accepted it as just a difference of opinion. But I really resent being compared to sweat shop laborers that produce a low quality product. And the idea that MGs are drawn from "the mass pool of desperate housewives, empty nesters and elderly" is insulting.

Most of the MGs I know are very diligent in being sure that the answers they give are correct and as up to date as possible. Our sources are mostly from the latest research at the university level. Most of us are experienced gardeners who volunteer our time and expertise to help others with less knowledge or ability to research the answers to horticultural questions. And most MGs in our locality ARE degreed professionals (though some not in horticulture) who want to learn more about horticulture for their own benefit and to help others learn more, also.

Yes, we make mistakes. Yes, there are SOME MGs who are royal pains in their attitudes. Yes, there are some who use and misuse the designation of Master Gardener. But the vast majority are dedicated to being the best help to the extension program and the public we serve that they can be.

Happyhoe, I don't know if your statement reflected your own attitude and thoughts about the MGs or you were citing how some in the green industry feel about us. Regardless, I hope this is not a wide spread attitude toward those who are giving of their time and energy and resources to help others.

Sandy

I was out of work today due to a back injury(typical with most energetic gardeners)
Happyhoe, I was so saddened to read what you wrote. I'm glad I don't agree what your statement.
I'm not only a master knitter, master canner,master mud maker,master volunteer,master cook, master cleaner, master grandma, master plant shopper and MASTER garden addict .
As a Master Gardener, I feel it is my duty to share my knowledge as others have shared knowledge with me. I love helping young and old gardeners alike.
The more I spread my addiction,,,,,the more wonderful folks I get to meet.

I also admire people who volunteer their time to help others. Taking on the volunteer position as a master gardener I give of myself unconditionally--if the job is weeding, raking, picking up trash, moving dead vehicles, picking up booze bottle and or junkie's needles off a city street, I do it.

So label me cheap labor--what I give from my heart and my spare time has no dollar sign on it.

When you have some spare time Happyhoe.. look up www.pennsylvaniahorticulturesociety.com and look up the Movie *Eden*
after seeing that movie,, please come back so we can talk-> why I take NO pay,,, and except the Master Gardener title.
(Guess which one is me in the movie)

I did ask a friend in the GREEN BUSINESS,,,did they feel this way about Master Gardners. He replyed NO WAY!

And my farm family is very proud of what I do, My family has been farming the same land in NJ since 1720. I think I have a little background in playing in the dirt.

This forum has been very inspiring,
Happy flowering
a NJ farm Girl

Just when I was feeling a little down about reading all this. I got a great phone call! I posted on another site about restoration of a historical garden to someone asking questions. This wonderful lady Kim contacted me and we spoke for about an hour on her wonderful project.

This relifted my spirits and reboosted my soul in the ever loving and ever questioning gardener.
Thanks Kim for the great call!! I'd be glad to help ya anytime!!

Happyhoe - and others who think similarly -

It might be a good idea to learn about who master gardeners really are - and about the organizational structure of the program. While it varies state to state, the basic concept is to educate gardening enthusiasts so that they can help others with gardening questions and public projects. Yes, they also provide volunteer service to the Extension Service - and yes, budget cuts have been severe.

Every group has its problem members - we're no exception. But your contention that the Green Industry as a whole "hates" us is absurd. Here in CT, we're working very closely with the green industry to develop new educational programs.

And contrary to your assertion that master gardeners are "desperate housewives, empty nesters and the elderly", the vast majority in the most recent class here were serious gardeners and professionals.

I'm sorry you feel so negatively about the program. While the title makes some people uncomfortable, the program itself is a valuable and rewarding experience.

I think it is true that we are Masters. Thus, we should be treated as such and we should be greatly revered by all. I'd like to see people bow when we enter the room. Maybe have a trumpeter or two to escort us and announce our arrival at the annual plant sale with great and glorious fanfare.

I fully believe we deserve our title and the great esteem it brings. All of you should, too. The tremendous salary we earn as an MG comes with awesome power and respect. We are an elite class filled with privilege. We've earned equal footing with other well paid entities (like the parade marshalls, church deacons, and park statues) and we should be rejoiced and worshipped.

If you want my honest opinion, I think we need a title that conveys a sense of the true omniscience we hold -- such as: Plant God or Goddess; The Divine Soveriegn of Soil; Emperial Emporer/Emporess of Everything Growing in Earth; The Most High, Potenent and Noble Prince/Princess of Plantdom; etc. Now, I realize some of these are lengthy, so I'd settle for Your Highness or Your Majesty when being addressed.

Again, I say we should hold our trowels high and demand our place among the deity not be berated or questioned in any way!!

mcrean1, Greetings to Your Royal Highness . Your sense of humor will see you through life. I hereby nominate you Goddess OF The Garden.
Your humble servant and slave (bow),
Eddie1

And this is from another "garden goddess". I tell people that what we have really mastered is the ability to know how to look for answers. Even tho I am a true GG of 10 years I am still looking for answers and that to me is the fun of the whole process.

Penny

ROFLOL! Love that attitude!

I am a Advanced Master Gardener and it takes work each year to keep that name. I do education hours every year and volunteer hours also. If I don't then I will no longer be that person. It takes work and commitment to do what you need to keep it up. I know how to get the answers I can't answer and help those I can. So find something else to complain about.

I am a new Master Gardener if you know anything about the program it is to teach others I think that is part of the reason I was chosen to take the program because I helped so many of my neighbors with their gardens. I was honored to be chosen to the program I work 40 hours a week am not a well to do person with lots of money. I will be squeezing out the volunteer hours from my busy schedule for I also have a teenager who is in a band where I spend many of volunteer hours as a band parent but it is something I want to do.Master Gardeners come in all shapes sizes.I do not claim to know everything but if I don't know I can find out for you.I am proud to be able to have the title Master Gardener now I don't understand why people get so uptight try doing it yourself you might just like it!Looking forward to doing my volunteer hours. Patty

Hmmm...switch to decaf maybe? ;)

I think everyone needs to lighten up on this subject. Master Gardener is just the name the extension picked to identify to volunteer helpers they have trained. Anyone who knows anything about the program knows the training doesn't create "Masters of Gardening". Master Gardeners are definately not akin to Master Plumbers, etc. Some folks learn a lot, some not much, but the volunteer activities of all are beneficial. The few MG's who think they have some exaulted gardening status should just be ignored. Many MG's have good gardening knowledge before taking the course. Even they benefit from the program.