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montauk daisy origin ?

Posted by softfurn z7LI (My Page) on
Thu, Sep 23, 04 at 16:19

OK. Please don't laugh at me for asking this. I've always assumed Montauk Daisy was named for, er, well, you know....kinda the obvious if you live here on LI.But I thought I would ask if anyone had a thought about this. On another forum, someone asked why they weren't readily available for sale, and hardly ever seen at nurseries. They did call it by the latin name(which I did not note).So I'm just curious if it is indiginous to this area and only grows well in this zone. Anyone??


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RE: montauk daisy origin ?

  • Posted by Donn_ Z 7, seaside,NY (My Page) on
    Thu, Sep 23, 04 at 19:33

Chrysanthemum nipponicum. It was called the Nippon Daisy long before some of the out east towns started using it in festivals, when it was renamed (by some) Montauk Daisy.


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RE: montauk daisy origin ?

How did you know that????


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I see them for sale at nurseries, farmstands and roadside setups.


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RE: montauk daisy origin ?

  • Posted by KWoods Cold z7 Long Is (My Page) on
    Fri, Sep 24, 04 at 16:03

Pretty.

Hard to kill too. Last year we had a driveway put in and the excavator ran 'em all over, crushed 'em to bits. When the dust settled we planted all the "divisions" and "cuttings" now we have many more than we originally did.


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RE: montauk daisy origin ?

The people that commented on how they were not readily available were NOT from LI. That is what prompted me to ask the question, thinking it was named after Montauk. I'd still like to know how Don knew that answer.


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RE: montauk daisy origin ?

  • Posted by Donn_ Z 7, seaside,NY (My Page) on
    Fri, Sep 24, 04 at 19:15

Several years ago, before I moved to LI, I used to work in the City, and lived in Queens. I spent untold hours driving to and from Montauk, to surfcast The End.

One night, I was fishing beside an older gentleman who lived in one of the little known small towns, inland (if that's possible) from the coastal towns out there, a town called Springs. He was a retired commercial fisherman, and the fishing was poor, so we chatted through the night, mostly about his fishing career and surfcasting. After sunrise, we were packing up to leave, and he invited me to his house for breakfast, which invitation I gladly accepted.

I followed him west in my van, and we pulled into a oyster shell paved driveway that wound back into a gorgeous landscape of flowers, shrubs and grasses. It seems surfcasting was not his only hobby. He fed me a fish and eggs breakfast, and, with a mug of hot coffee in my hand, he fed me a tour of his gardens.

I won't get into the rest of his landscape, but one bed, snuggled in next to a tiny grove of Beach Plums, jumped out at me. It was approximately 12' in diameter, crudely oval in shape, and both lined and interspersed with beautiful medium sized stones. The only other occupants of the bed were a gorgeous cluster of Montauk Daisies.

I'd seen wild clusters of them along the shoreline from the point back to the village, but I'd never seen them in a garden, and I asked him what they were. He said "They're Montauk Daisies now," with a sneer and a salty look to punctuate his answer.

He went on to tell me that he started the plants that filled the bed with seed gathered from the cliffs along the surfcaster's path. He stuck an envelope into his waders, and slogged up to the plants at the end of their blooming season (which is the height of the fall fishing run), and taught himself how to find and harvest the seeds. The rest is evident in his gorgeous little bed.

This all happened in the 50's, when the villages on the South Fork were not as developed as they are now. In the course of the gentrification of the area, nurseries and landscape professionals moved in, and decided that the ubiquitous Nippon Daisy was an important facet of any locally correct landscape design, but the name was all wrong. They changed it to Montauk Daisy.

I have never researched this subject, so I have no idea if it's really what happened, or the caffeine-augmented sleepy rambling of a fisherman/gardener. It's true enough for me.


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RE: montauk daisy origin ?

  • Posted by BSG1 z7 NY (My Page) on
    Fri, Sep 24, 04 at 20:19

Great Story!


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RE: montauk daisy origin ?

What a wonderful story. Thank you soooooo much for sharing that. I hope I didn't seem nosy.... it just seemed like a piece of trivia that somehow escaped my notice and I just had to find out where you got that one from. True or not,it all sounds good to me.


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RE: montauk daisy origin ?

The story sounds good to me also! BTW, I was just on the South Fork of LI for a few days last week and noticed all the Montauk Daisies in bloom EVERYWHERE. I was able to buy a Montauk Daisy plant at Fort Hill Native Plants Nursery in Montauk before I left. I wanted to say that I bought a Montauk Daisy in Montauk. Silly, huh?

I had fun visiting all the nurseries in the area and bought and brought a few plants home as living souvenirs :o) There sure are a lot of LARGE specimen trees and shrubs at those nurseries for instant screening or landscaping (if you have the $$$).


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RE: montauk daisy origin ?

Donn, you tell a great story. Thank you, I enjoyed it.

You also brought something up for me... I've lived on Long Island all my life and have seen the "THE END" bumper stickers all the time. I just thought they were indicative of the town of Montauk, the lighthouse, etc. Does it have more of a fishing significance than that?

I included a link to a picture I took at the lighthouse years ago, thought you might enjoy it. It's of the memorial to the fisherman lost at sea.

Here is a link that might be useful: Fisherman memorial


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RE: montauk daisy origin ?

  • Posted by Donn_ Z 7, seaside,NY (My Page) on
    Tue, Sep 28, 04 at 14:18

greenfreak...I don't know where The End came from, but the from a few hundred yards north of the point, around almost to the village, is one of the finest fishing spots I've ever seen. Because of the currents, rocks and other natural phenomena that are found there, it's a regular freeway of migrating sport fish like Striped Bass, Fluke, Bluefish and such. The structure of the point attracts huge schools of baitfish, which, in turn, attract the rest of the food chain.


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RE: montauk daisy origin ?

  • Posted by Cady 6b/Sunset34 MA (My Page) on
    Fri, Oct 1, 04 at 13:57

That was a great story, Donn. I'm saving it in my files. Thank you.


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RE: montauk daisy origin ?

For anyone interested in buying them, they can be found at Home Depot nursieries in the NorthEast and mid Atlantic areas, I don't know about the rest of the country. HD has been selling them for three autums now, at least our in South Jersey.


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RE: montauk daisy origin ?

  • Posted by Donn_ Z 7, seaside,NY (My Page) on
    Wed, Oct 27, 04 at 19:08

Update.

According to the American Horticultural Society A-Z Encyclopedia of Garden Plants (great book, if you don't have it , get it for yourself for The Holidays (Solstice)), it's now called Nipponanthemum nipponicum, a species with it's own genus. Google it for all the hot scoop!


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RE: montauk daisy origin ?

Does anyone know how to collect seeds from it? I promised some people from another forum I would collect some but I'm not sure when they will be ready. I'm assuming the yellow center needs to dry a bit, but I don't every recall seeing a seed in all the years I've had it. Susan


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RE: montauk daisy origin ?

  • Posted by Donn_ Z 7, seaside,NY (My Page) on
    Fri, Oct 29, 04 at 7:06

The eye, or yellow center of the flower contains little gizmos called disk florets, thin strands of plant material with the color on one end. The other end develops into a seed if conditions have been right. When the casing that holds the flower together turns brown, and the stem at it's attachment point is brown, cut off the flower and let it dry indoors for a few days. Then simply rub the colored ends of the disk florets with your fingernail, and both the dried florets (chaff) and the seeds will drop off. The seeds are generally 4-sided, woody, fluted and wider at one end than the other.

If you've seen the seed of Shasta Daisy, or most other Chrysanthemum varieties, you'll recognize the seed.


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RE: montauk daisy origin ?

Nipponanthemum nipponicum Nipponanthemum nipponicum
Family: Compositae
Japanese name: HAMAGIKU
Plant type: deciduous in winter, perennial plant, terrestrial
Habitat: coastal areas, Southern part of Japan
Blooming season: September-November
Height: 20-50cm
I heard that this species is indigenous only to Japan. Therefore, its species name includes the word "NIPPON" that means Japan in Japanese. I also heard that a famous American horticulturist, Mr. Luther Burbank, created Shasta Daisy (Leucanthemum x superbum) by hybridizing Leucanthemum vulgare with this species


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RE: montauk daisy origin ?

Great story, Donn!


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I surfed in here. If you ever get the chance visit Luther Burbank's home and garden in Santa Rosa, CA. I really enjoyed visiting.


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RE: montauk daisy origin ?

I killed them by cutting them back at the wrong time of year.

Anyone have some I can divide and replant?
Cherry


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RE: montauk daisy origin ?

  • Posted by kwoods Cold z7 Long Is (My Page) on
    Mon, Dec 4, 06 at 10:32

Very hard to kill these. I have some. They take off from cuttings as well. Come by and pick them up in spring if you want. I'm on the North Shore, Nassau County.


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RE: montauk daisy origin ?

I would like to have some montauk daisies.. I am in Port Washington.. Let me know what is the best time to get cuttings. I suspect it is in the spring. Cherry


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RE: montauk daisy origin ?

  • Posted by kwoods Cold z7 Long Is (My Page) on
    Tue, Dec 5, 06 at 13:02

I'll just chuck 'em towards Hempstead Harbor then and hope they float around Sands Point over to Manhasset Bay. I'm in Glen Cove.

They will be here in spring and you are welcome to them. Drop me an email when you're ready and I'll be happy to dig some for you.


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RE: montauk daisy origin ?

THANK YOU for this posting! I have aquired the care of a widower's garden and there is one of these there. He said his wife always refered to it as a Winter Daisy and I hadn't been able to find anything on it. Now I know.
Tahnks again
Paula


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RE: montauk daisy origin ?

We vacationed in Montauk Nov 09, the Montauk Daisies were in full bloom, and for sale at roadside stands and nurseries everywhere. I bought one, took it home to Sacramento, California, split it in two, planted them, and they grew and bloomed in Full May-early July, 2010. It is now Sept, and they are blooming in full Again! And The Central Valley is hot and dry like Las Vegas! They obviously are quite easy to please!


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RE: montauk daisy origin ?

Wow! Long ago post. Funny about Montauk Daisies because I recd 1 plant at least 28+/- yrs ago from my DIL. My son, (her husband) dug some up about 12 yrs ago. Bottom line, they grow & spread like crazy! He & I are both loaded w/them. I was just looking at a patch & thought about transplanting some. This patch was planted about 7 yrs ago & are huge now. I love them esp in the fall. I do not understand how anyone could kill them. I give them no attention & they continue to flourish.


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