In my yard, parts are very hard compacted clay. The clover does well there, but after a certain point, it has improved the soil to where the grass can outcompete the clover. So there are places that were bare ground 5 years ago, which now are covered with clover, and places that were solid clover 5 years ago which are now halfway decent grass. I expect eventually, most of the clover will be driven out by grass, and the bare spots will be totally gone. I have gotten thyme in places, and one of these years will weed it out. It doesn't blend in with the rest of the lawn. I also weed out clover that gets too close to the brick edging because it does tend to overgrow it, and is just an annoyance.

Mow high, leave the clippings and don't mind a few imperfections, and lawn is about the easiest thing going in this climate. It doesn't need watered, it doesn't need fed, and there is this nifty machine that does all the work.

We have clover in our lawn as well. I really enjoy it. I think it keeps the soil fertile and helps support the lawn without having to fertilize. It does seem to draw bunnies, which so far I do enjoy seeing once in awhile in the yard even though they do tend to eat other things which doesn't please me. [g]

Although I suppose I enjoy a good healthy solid green lawn crisply mowed and edged as well as the next guy, I really prefer a casual lawn with a mix of related plants growing in it. No pesticides, herbicides or fertilizers. Much easier and better for the environment and the health of anyone using the yard.

As for how much of the lawn is clover...I would say it is thicker in some areas than others and maybe is about 40% of our lawn?

pm2

I too have mostly clover both the purple & white as my lawn. Since my ground can be uneven and bumpy (an old hay field) leaving the "lawn" a bit longer helps hide the bumps. I love to watch the bees bob from flower to flower. I like the color and texture of the clover, not such a bright in your eyes green as grass.

I would love to see pictures of these clover lawns! Would anyone care to share? Thanks.

Hi Stoloniferous,

I don't have any pictures of my lawn, I could go take one today, but I don't think snow is what you had in mind. :0 Won't it be nice to see some green again soon. Ground hog day is comming soon...

Anyone else have a photo from last year?

I have a lot of clover in my lawn. Years ago most grass seed mixes included clover because it was healthy for the lawn. Then they invented the weed killer that kills everything but grass (including clover) and then clover didn't work in the lawn anymore.

I do agree about it getting into garden beds, it can be a real pest that way. In my yard it really loves the rich soil of my rose beds, it is constantly creeping in.

Happy2beeme  haha! Silly me. I would be happy to wait until Spring to see pictures. :)

I just thought of another great benefit to having a clover lawn...4-leaf clovers. I find several dozen of them every year and press them.

I'm still waiting for the snow to go away! We have had 114" this year so far, nope not a typo it's 114 and counting. No lawn in sight.

:) Karyn

karyn, that reminds me of how I used to pick four-leaf clovers in my parents' lawn as a kid. Which makes me contemplate what it would take to grow the sort of careless grass-and-clover mix that they had. . . it was always lush-looking, and it withstood every abuse the neighborhood kids could throw at it.

The snow mented this weekend, and now I can see the sorry thin brown state of our so-called grass!

How would I go about getting a big bag of native clover seed? Thanks!

Thank you gallica!

Hi Stoloniferous,

Sorry I haven't been here in awhile. I have been spending every avail. moment out shoveling either the path to the barn, the fence, (electric) so it will work or using the heat pack. OH my back!

After last nights snow fall,the snow is up to the 2nd strand of wire on the fence, that translates to 5' compacted... the horses can just step over the wire if they want to. COME ON SPRING!!

At our local Agway they sell bags of seed mix, I needed to patch up a bare spot and they sold me a mix that the Highway Dept. uses. I can't remember the name of it... It has clover both white and purple as well as timmothy. I have a friend who works for the highway dept I will ask him if he knows what the seed mix is.

I have always found the local hardware/farm stores:Agway or Blue Seal to be helpful and really know what they are talking about. Tell them you want clover, field grass and wild flowers...

-Karyn

I would say half my backyard is clover. It was here when I moved in and I never put anything down to kill it. (We have well water and I don't like using stuff unless I have to, which means I learn to live with it.)

That being said, in the middle of summer my lawn is always green. From the street it looks like all grass and people tend to think I work very hard to keep it that way. It's my little secret.

Thanks for getting back to me, Karyn, and good luck with those snowed-under fences!

I've never been to a "farm store" before, but they must be around here somewhere. :)

Face, your little secret is safe with me. ;)

Love clover. Deep rooted, out-competes many weeds, easy under foot, great in the compost pile. With a thousand feet or so of edge I'm not too concerned with it's travels... use a variety of clovers in the fields too- what a sight

I don't about Blue Seal, but Agway is all over the place. Around here (SE MA), several of the good local nurseries are also Agways - keeps them going through the winter. They're usually good for bird supplies too.

You can find a local Agway by plugging in your zipcode here.

Agway website

Claire

Karyn - I hear you on trying to keep horses in when the snow is piling high alongside those fences! We had a gate pop off its hinges a few weeks ago due to ice/snow buildup under the gate. Our pony, not being called "Sneaks" for nothing, took off up the back hill with his buddy and ended up staring in the window of somebody's house 1/2 mile away!

re: clover. It's an integral part of our lawn. Stays green through the worst droughts, needs no maintenance and it attracts tiny pollinating insects which provide food for insect-eating birds. Just don't walk in it barefoot when it's in flower....

Clover used to be included in lawn seed mixes before the days of Weed & Feed....

Stoloniferous:

I uploaded an example of my clover lawn in the Garden Galleries. Check that out. Very easy to care for but, as someone already pointed out, it's not good for walking barefoot when in bloom and covered in bees! (Unfortunately, I kept getting an error message so I inadvertently posted it three times.)

ericofwebster - your house is absolutely adorable!!!!

Thanks, Linda!

Right now it has a very different feel, all covered in snow. Will spring ever return and will my garden ever be green again? I'm not sure I can hold on.....

Wow! Nice photos! I couldn't figure out how to link to the folder, if there is such a thing, since I found them in "recent" but here is one of the photos. Beautiful house and garden!

Here is a link that might be useful: one of eric's photos

Agreed - beautiful landscaping with the house nestled in the surrounding gardens...

Eric, what a beautiful lawn and garden! Thank you for sharing that. :)

ellen_s

Wow, the power of snow and ice... Gland to hear you retreaved Sneaks back ok. Its scarry when they show up missing, things have changes so much. When I was a kid the neighbor would just put the horse back in the barn and you would find out much later how it got in the barn, today the neighbors would just as soon hit it with their car or pretend they didn't see and and do nothing about it. The animals seem to be a bothersom to them. I wonder why they choose to move from CT or RI INTO THE COUNTRY (dirt roads) and then want nothing to do with country life....

any way, those were very nice photos and I can't wait for the chance to take new ones this year, thanks for sharing.

-Karyn

Eric,

Thank you for posting the photos of your home.
It is uplifting to see the beautiful clover and flowers surrounding your adorable home.

Right now, I am watching the snow retreat and the ugly mass of old leaves and twigs all over my yard.

Just out of curiosity what happens with a clover lawn during the winter (assuming the average winter temp. is around the freezing pt. with moderate precip.)?

I actually purchase Dutch white clover to seed my lawn. It is lower growing and intended in place of a lawn. It is slow to take but, no mowing, fertilizing, no lime, no water, no dormant look mid summer, durable for kids etc. What can be the down side?????

i also love clover! I have bright green circular mounds in my yard with tiny pink flowers. i think it is beautiful!

I also have a patch of prickly little balls that get caught in the hems of your jeans and if you don't see them you will feel them hurt your leg. they are very very sharp! I have sprayed the patches with white vinegar and hopefully this spring i can kill them! ouch!

Thanks for everyone's input on clover lawns. I'm interested in proposing a clover lawn to my condo board in the interest of cutting our lawn care expenses (weekly lawn-mowing, plus TruGreen treatments)

For those who have a clover lawn, how often do you actually mow in the summer time? Can you plant clover over an existing turf lawn or do you have to remove it first?

Thanks for your input!

Our lawn is a pretty mix of white clover, red clover, pasture/hay grasses, bluegrass, lawn grasses, dandelions, violets (in the shaded areas) and heaven knows what all else. About 2/3rds of our lawn is pasture for our old pony.

Yes we do have to mow every week, but our lawn is a mix. The white clover seems shorter and slower growing, so I do imagine an all white clover lawn would need mowing less often.

One strange thing I've noticed lately when re-seeding small areas, is that the price of white clover seed has sky-rocketted, while the price of bluegrass (once expensive) has fallen.

The all grass lawn is promoted by Scott and other seed companies to sell their own product, along with their own brands of broad-leaf plant (weed) killers. It is like many things - follow the money to find out why (mixed plant lawns have disappeared over the years.)

The clover lawn in Eric's picture is beautiful, as is his house! And I laugh at the very good advice to avoid walking over clover in barefeet. Clover fairly hums with bees all summer.

If the lawn is truly a clover monoculture, then the mowing can be dictated by how fast the clover grows. The problem is the same as with any monoculture - how do you keep out the things that don't belong. The solution is to be reasonably broadminded about what sorts of plants are acceptable in a mowed area.

If you want to reduce the lawn care expenses, I'd start by having a hissy fit about the length of the lawn. Mowing high (and leaving the clippings) can cover a multitude of lawn sins, but isn't usually done by the mow and blow crowd.

I forgot to mention that, mad. We set our mower blade pretty high up. Have never had to water our lawn, and the blade is spared from encounters with rocks. There are times I wish we could get rid of the clippings when they stick to our shoes and pantlegs and get tracked over the floors and carpets, but perhaps they serve as fertilizer and sunscreen for the lawn.

In this drought, our lawn has been a beautiful brown color. But I noticed it getting greener lately - turns out the crab grass is really taking over. I had been thinking of sowing additional clover out back - hopefully to keep the bunnies full and out of the veggie garden. But wondering - which is dominant - crab grass or clover? Does anyone know?

Hi pixie_lou -
I have plenty of both, so I can't answer the question.They're the greenest things in the lawn at this point.

Clover is a perennial. True crabgrass is an annual that requires light to germinate. So it is pretty much confined to bare spots. It's not something I have a lot of, since my 'lawn' is almost all perennial plants, whether grass, clover or weeds.

After reading this thread 2 years ago, I covered a lot of bare spots in my lawn with clover seed last summer. I was pretty happy with the results - nice green patches in the drought of summer. However, even though clover is perennial, it is not evergreen. So I ended up with huge bare patches again this winter and spring. I'm not so concerned out in the back - I can wait for the clover to fill in. But I'm not thrilled with the huge bare spot I had in the front yard. So I have now over seeded that area with grass seed again.

Thanks for posting your results Pixie Lou. I have a small area that I was thinking about whether to sow with white clover but I don't think I would like the brown bare spots for any period of time. I enjoy the clover with the lawn, and really, now that I think about it, I don't think I have 40% of my lawn as clover. I think it is more like 30%. So I wouldn't plant white clover alone.

BTW, there is a very new strain of grass seed being introduced this year, that was developed in the Wayland area, that sounds intriguing. It is supposed to be very very drought tolerant and a very slow grower. I am considering trying some of that with some clover mixed into it for my little patch.

prairiemoon - thanks for reminding me about Pearls Premium. Since I only have bare patches to fill in, I hadn't given much thought about what type of grass seed to buy. But you are right - this could be an excellent alternative to the clover lawn.

I went to a talk at our local library by Mr. Maddock a while ago. I will admit that I went in with a negative attitude. But he explained that this grass seed is a blend of regular grass seeds - it is not a hybrid or anything genetically engineered.

Both Whole Foods and Mahoneys carry the seed. Or if you go to his web site (pearlspremium.com), you can plug in your zip code and find a local retailer.

Here is a link that might be useful: Article about local grass.

Why would a hybrid be bad? Almost every bit of grass seed you buy today is hybridized. People have been hybridizing plants since the beginning of agriculture. Are we supposed to only grow species?

Steve

I bought 5 pounds of white clover on Amazon this past winter. It was reasonably priced in larger quantities. I overseeded with it during the winter, you can also do this before a rain.

Way back in the 1980s, I remember reading an explanation about how clover is a good companion for grass. It fills in the empty spots, and fixes nitrogen, which nourishes the grass. Eventually, a healthy turf grass will outcompete the clover and most other weeds.

Now, clover is seen as a weed - I think this is a marketing ploy perpetrated by the lawn chemical companies, which have brainwashed property owners into thinking that a lawn made up of 100% turf grass is the only acceptable standard.

It flabbergasts me that people dump toxic chemicals on the earth in pursuit of the perfect lawn!

Pearls Premium has been around for a while. I recall hearing about it several years ago. I wonder if it is Tall Fescue grass with some beefed-up marketing? Tall Fescue is touted as drought-tolerant because of deep roots.

I went to the web site but didn't easily see any label information.

Do you have to kill all the grass first or can you just sow clover seeds in the grass and eventually have a clover lawn?

SandraLee - I would ask this question on the lawn forum or on the organic lawn forum.

http://forums.gardenweb.com/forums/orglawn/

http://forums2.gardenweb.com/forums/lawns/

Will do. I will read those forums before posting another question. OMG I really want a clover lawn. I see this thread started a few yrs ago. So I guess you are all still happy with the clover. And I wouldn't mind letting a few patches of thyme get into it also! Down with grass!! :-)

This post was edited by sandraleebeagan on Fri, Oct 24, 14 at 19:48

Since this thread started, my lawn's improved a lot - much more clover, more thyme, and less crab grass. That's from a combination of occasional applications of corn gluten meal in spring, hand weeding in summer, replanting of grass on certain worn areas in fall, and ... dumb luck. My lawns have also gotten considerably smaller over the years, as the beds all around the garden have grown (great thing about movable edging).

My only complaint with clover is that it self-sows and/or creeps into the brick paths that we have along most of the lawns' edges, and it's quite a pain to remove. I'm not terribly wild about the way it looks when the flowers turn brown, either, but I can live with that in exchange for not needing to fertilize the lawn.

My lawns are all former pastureland so they were well fertilized in their past lives by livestock. Only deer and rabbits graze and fertilize it now. Since I have at least an acre of lawn, I definitely do not fertilize or water it, ever. Nor has it ever, nor will it ever, see pesticides or herbicides. We mow it at a high setting, not close to the ground because it is healthier for the plants. Back in the day we used to re-seed any bare patches with a combination of white clover and bluegrass seed. It gets less wear and tear from animal hooves these days, so re-seeding has not been necessary in recent times.

I have clover in the lawn, both white and red, many types of grasses (pasture grass and lawn grass), dandelions, mint in the wet spots, violets, and a host of other plants. I love the diversity. Every summer the clover blossoms attract a host of pollinators.

I love the diversity of plants in my lawn, too, but have to say that the bees make me nervous - no fun to step on those, and that's another down side to clover.

It's true, Digging! Bare feet or open-toed shoes are not recommended for crossing a lawn carpetted in bumblebees!

I've been stung in the foot, as a kid. But I am going to try the clover lawn. Better than the buttercup and crabgrass lawn that is trying to establish itself I think!