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carriejane_gw

Desparetely need help with herbs and garden

carriejane
18 years ago

Hi

I love plants. I really do. I love the idea of enjoying my garden all spring, summer and fall and growing herbs in the winter that I can use to cook with. That being said, I can't seem to get out of my own way. I have a friend that I can ask questions of but find I don't even know what to ask. Te catalogs confuse me because some say partial sun and when I call, they say they really need partial to full sun. My soil is sandy and don't know if that matters. I got a few catalogs but don't know what I am doing...

My back yard butts against wetlands and is partially shaded I think. Front yard gets sun almost all day. I want to plant something very tall and interesting as a back drop for the rest of my plants. Now I learn they come in all different sizes, bloom at different times, Oy! I am completely overwhelmed. I love color and interesting plants. I just can't take the life of another tulip...

And then there are my poor herbs. I lovingly put my rosemary, basil and thyme in pots is my sunniest window that faces west. The rosemary has been reduced to brown crunchy twigs and my basil is yellow and on its last legs.

I have spent so much on plants that die. I need help. I really want my herbs to live through the winter and want a pretty yard. HELP!

Comments (13)

  • lindac
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Not likely that any herbs will live through the winter in a heated house in the north east.....treat them as annuals, but for tarragon, chives, sage and thyme.
    Tulips are also pretty much annuals....but for some or those planted in dry areas....
    Plant daffodils instead....
    Linda C

  • carriejane
    Original Author
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Is that what it is? Heat? There has to be a way to grow my herbs. Any ideas out there??

  • MaKoShark
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    carriejane,

    coming from a *cold* country I know that you can have herbs inhouse over winter. A greenhouse would be perfect - but there are ways to overwinter herbs without that.

    Searching the gardenweb forums, I found this thread that seems to be quite what you're looking for:
    http://forums.gardenweb.com/forums/load/herbs/msg0917151618151.html
    This thread also seems quite interesting:
    http://forums.gardenweb.com/forums/load/carolgard/msg0918065022667.html

    I do suppose that the browning of the Rosemary as well as the colour change of the Basil have something to do with the way they are kept... perhaps it would be a good idea to read up on the cultural requirements of plants, especially herbs in your case.

    HTH,
    MaKoShark

  • blueheron
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Actually, a south window would be the sunniest. But I have also heard that herbs are difficult to grow indoors over the winter. Maybe you'll have better luck.

  • lindac
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    carrijean....it's the heat....the dry conditions the lack of good hot sunshine....
    Herbs will grow inside...in a window....but very few can get them to thrive.
    If you just want a plant to provide a leaf now and then....you might be able to do it...
    But....buying your fresh herbs at the store is cheaper than a green house!
    Linda C

  • username_5
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    CarrieJane,

    You have what is known as 'black thumb'.

    The condition is curable, but the problem is you are largely ignorant of how to grow anything and don't really know where to start learning. This is perfectly normal and not at all something to be ashamed of.

    It isn't difficult at all to grow most things, but trying to aquire that initial bit of knowledge that turns failure after failure to success is daunting initially.

    Garden Web is terrific, but not so much for info on how to go from black thumb to green thumb.

    My advice to you is to look for garden clubs in your area and join one and if the clubs in your area are at all like the one's in my area you will quickly find a kind soul to take you under his/her wing and show you how to do whatever you wish to do.

    By all means hang out here and ask any and all questions as you will find the folks here very friendly and helpful, but when trying to go from black thumb to green thumb there is nothing like a live person to show you in person. Find a garden club and you will be well on your way.

  • triciae
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    CarrieJane, I'd also like to suggest that you make a library trip some weekend when the weather is awful & you're looking for something to do. There are a multitude of terrific books available that will help you get started.

    It is an interesting (and very true) saying that gardeners use that says, "More plants are killed by kindness than by neglect." Many new gardeners water too much, fertilize too much, transplant into too large a pot, etc. Using terra-cotta pots will help a lot if you have a tendency to overwater. But, in general...check out half a dozen books and curl up with your favorite beverage and by spring you'll be well on your way and anxious to get started.

  • carriejane
    Original Author
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Thank you to everyone! I have found that there is a garden club somewhat nearby. I will work on my Black Thumb. (I knew there was a name for this condition). I have already learned that there is a plant called a Hosta that has a very good chance of surviving. Found one I like called Fire and Ice. Very pretty and can withstand my "love and attention". So thanks to all. I will report back once I get my education in order!

  • kris
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Oh dear,

    Carrie Jane take a deep breath, relax, no one has a black thumb, you just need to learn a few tricks is all :). I suspect you may be loving your plants to death.

    First things first, all herbs are different, they come from all over the world so each one has to be considered individually.

    I suspect you are over watering. I don't think it's the heat inside, I think its watering and lack of sun. I've grown herbs inside in boston. To water most plants in pots: Water until it drains out the holes in the bottom of the pot. I stick em in the sink. If any water is in their little dish (mine don't get dishes), discard it, sitting in water (called 'wet feet') leads to root rot with most plants but especially herbs (this is really important). Then don't water again until when you stick your finger into the soil about an inch or so down it feels mostly dry, but not bone dry. Always water at first signs of wilting.

    The herbs you mentioned are mediterraneian, so they tend to like things relatively dry, hot, and sunny.

    Rosemary (native to greece seasides-rosemary=dew of the sea) is one of the trickiest herbs, they just are finicky, and they are hard to over winter. If you find a good spot for rosemary don't move it-one theory is that the plant adapts slowly to changes in light etc because of a thick covering on it's leaves. Rosemary hates 'wet feet' meaning that it can't sit in standing water or too wet soil or it will get root rot and die. Rosemary also hates to be dry, which means that it's darn hard to water right especially since it doesn't wilt to tell you when it wants water. It needs a really well draining soil too-so lots of vermiculite/pearlite. Rosemary also likes to get powdery mildew-white fluffy stuff where the leaf meets the stem-this can be treated with 1tsp oil, 1tsp baking soda, 1/8 tsp ivory dish soap, 1 qt water. However, powdery mildew is tough and it can take a plant down fast. The also like to get spider mites (very very fine webbing with black or redish spots on the web-best seen by holding up to light) which is best treated by rinsing with water.

    Basil, can be grown indoors, but it really needs Direct sunlight shining straight on its leaves. Your kinda biding your time until you can plant new plants or cuttings outside in spring, but it can do OK inside. Basil gets the sunniest spot in the house. Basil is also an annual, so it will grow for a season or so, make flowers and seeds "go to seed or bolt", and then die. However, you can make basil more bushy by pinching the tips, and if you see flowers start to form pinch them out to stop the plant from bolting. Basil likes more water than rosemary, but it will rot if it's in standing water. Yellowing could also be from lack of fertilization, I would fertilize with fish emulsion (outside-stinky) at the reccomended dose or Peters at 1/2 concentrated of what it says on the package. I would fertilize no more than 1x/month, herbs generally do best with no fertilizer but in a container where your washing out their nutrients they need a kick every so often.

    Thyme. Probably the easiest one you mentioned. Thymes likes relatively dry soil but it's not quite as picky. Water as I mentioned above, don't let it have wet feet.

    These plants should be in individual pots to account for their different watering needs.

    Pots: I like to use store bought potting soil and mix in about 1/3 vermiculite (maybe up to 1/2 for rosemary)-I don't like pearlite. You don't want to keep them in the plastic 4" pots from the store. I really prefer terracotta clay, it breaths better. You know you need to repot when you CAREFULLY slip the pot off the plant and see the roots wrapping around the pot (too much and it's called 'root bound'). You want to 'pot up' to a pot that is 2-4" larger so atleast a 6" pot. When you transplant gently 'tickle' the roots to kinda comb out the bound roots. Then replant in the larger pot, water well, and your done.

    If your plants are real gonners, I suggest starting over, it's hard to pull em back from the grave.

    "I have a friend that I can ask questions of but find I don't even know what to ask"

    As your friend if you can come over some time for a demo, bring a dessert and it could be a great time :)

    "catalogs confuse me..." toss em, go to the local private nursury and as someone who is knowledgeable what will grow well and what you want. They know best for your area/soil/zone etc. If they are a good nursury, they will get very excited to share info with you.

    I'm a bit militant about this, I try to pick var that will do well in my climate. As for shade,sun,etc, I try my best, don't worry too much, and wait I to see, sometimes things need to be moved, some will die. In general, I really think that we stress too much, I mean they are plants after all, if they want to survive they best hop to it, they can adapt and take more than we give em credit for.

    "soil is sandy and don't know if that matters"
    Sure it matters, but look around you, obviously things can grow in MA. Personally, I think more can grow in sandy soil than in heavy clay. In general NE soil is pretty good-throw some bagged compost down and your golden.

    "I want to plant something very tall and interesting.." lol that's not detailed enough. Tree, shrub, herb, color, etc. For herbs, head over to the herb forum...I think you might like growing lavenders, I don't know lavenders too well being from FL but they do.

    Gosh, this got long. I hope it was helpful. Relax, have a glass of wine, enjoy growing. It's not something to stress over.

  • carriejane
    Original Author
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Thanks Kris!

    I am actually printing this out and having a talk with my herbs later today...after the wine.

  • maggiemuffin360
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Kris,
    What a nice response to a request for help.
    I've just moved a rosemary plant inside for the winter & am hoping I can keep it going at least for a while (love the aroma) so your comments about rosemary are appreciated.

    Margaret

  • Skybird - z5, Denver, Colorado
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I second everything Kris said. All excellent advice! And I agree that your herb problems are most likely from overwatering. Her recommended "stick your finger in the soil" method to check for when they need watering is good for most things you might grow inside in pots. From your description, it sounds like your rosemary is a gonner, and I'd recommend waiting till you have a little more experience to try it again. Rosemary is definitely one of the most difficult herbs to grow indoors. Where I used to work, even the professional grower tended to have trouble with it---so don't feel bad that yours didn't make it. If your basil doesn't make it, get some seed and try again. Seed is cheap and it germinates very quickly---and you'll get plenty of seed in just one packet to try several times if necessary. There are lots of wonderful varieties of basil to experiment with. Give them as much direct sun as you possibly can starting as soon as you see the first two leaves (seed leaves), and if your plants start to get too leggy or ratty looking in a few months, start some more before you throw the old ones out. I have a couple different types of basil going that I just started a month or two ago. Start a couple more about a month before the average last frost date in your area and you'll save the money you'd have spent to go out and buy plants in spring. With sun, parsley is easy to grow inside too, but it takes a little longer to germinate. (Rosemary is hard to start from seed)

    Don't be afraid to experiment--indoors and out. When you actually do something yourself, you'll remember more than if you just read it. Local GOOD garden centers (not Home Depot!) are usually your best resource---especially if something's going wrong. If you have a problem, take them a sample to show them what's happening (MUCH better than just a description) and you'll probably be able to get some help. And when something doesn't do well or dies on you, it's not a failure at all! It's just more experience to help you do better the next time. That's how we all learn---and even people who have been gardening for 50 years have things die on them. Enjoy the process! And experimenting with seed can save you lots of money.

    Hosta will be great (and easy to grow) for your shady areas---and they like wet feet too. And there's a kazillion different varieties to mix and match ('Royal Standard' has fragrant flowers). With hosta you'll be starting with plants, but you can save money by starting with small ones and in a year they'll be big enough to divide and make a dozen new small plants to move wherever you want them. One thing to be aware of, though, is that they come up VERY late in spring, so be sure you mark where you plant them and then just wait for them in spring---they didn't die! Sooner or later they will be along!

    Here's a link to perennials.com where you can look up basic info about many different perennials. There are 3 different search options in the left column. (type Fire and Ice in the #2 search box to try it) They list more than a hundred hosta varieties.

    Good luck, and, the most important thing.....
    Have fun,
    Skybird

    Here is a link that might be useful: Perennials.com

  • lov2cook00
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    one thing you might want to do is place your plants away from direct heater air if you have central heat and another thing to watch for is overwatering ofentimes when we see the plants arent looking well we water the plant and when they begin to look even worse we water some more and finnish the job, we love them to death; then we learn to water sparingly until we learn who needs how much of what.
    potting soil holds a lot of water.
    Now i water when i see the plant begging to wilt a little
    TRUST ME I HAVE KILLED A FEW THINGS!