You ever tried using a weed hound?

I thought weed hounds were for dandelions and similar weeds with one taproot. I read they are not good on violets. Violets have very weak stems that easily break off the tuberous root.The seeds don't blow around, they fall nearby and form colonies. Aargh!

Ouch, I see from some google images that violets have a very fibrous root system- do you know if they are rhizomatous? A weed hound looks like it take these out as they grab the root and not the stem. Plus the root looks to be sort of clumpy which is another bonus. Otherwise you might have to go the unfortunate route of either starting over with a vinegar blast or use a selective herbicide (I'm guessing 2,4D will do a number on violets) even though you would not call that 'organic'.

I'll apologize in advance for a lengthy response (no matter how quick an answer I think it will be, it always turns into several paragraphs. Look, here's a 2nd paragraph already!)

I've dealt with violets in my lawn since we moved in 4 years ago. I'm trying to be organic as well, but I'm more on a hybrid program currently. My experience with this @#$@*&! weed is as follows:

1. Vinegar sort-of works for me. But I think the root/bulb system is too strong for it have much effect. Plus, the difficulty of spraying a non-selective product in the middle of the rest of the lawn you're trying to keep. Side note on vinegar - I used a whole spray bottle 2 weekends ago (if you're in the DC area, Maureen, you may remember the sunny weather that Saturday). Sprayed around 10 AM - no real effect after 45 minutes to an hour. This was in direct sun. Sprayed again around 11, when the temperature was up around 80 - turned weeds brown in about 20 minutes. My conclusion - vinegar doesn't only need sun - it needs heat. At least 80 degrees. Caveat - it may just take much longer to work in lower temps, and the 2nd dosage may not have been needed.

Anyway, back to violets - I think it will take repeated doses - it may shrivel the leaves, but it won't take out the root system - will probably require constant killing of the re-sprouted leaves.

2. RU / Glysophate - Don't recall if I've used this on the violets. Most of my violets are in the lawn, so I'm hesitant to use it there. The rest are in my rose beds - I'm VERY hesitant to use it there! However, violets, due to their nice large leaves, are execellent candidates for the RU on the sponge/glove treatment.

3. Weed-b-gone / 2-4-D - I've sprayed them several times. Violets are like George Foreman in the ring - you can hit him several times, but they just won't go down. I've direct sprayed, and I've used the hose attachment to spray the whole lawn. With one application, they'll shrivel. I think it will work - but as the directions say - it will take several applications.

4. Hand pulling - I've had the same observations as you - a weed hound would not work on these, as they lack a true tap root. I believe they're related to the Iris family, and thus have a sideways bulb, and it's very prone to snapping off. When I weed them from the mulched rose bed, I'm able to get the bulb and most of the rhizomes (may not be the correct term), as the soil is fairly loose. (another observation - I used leaf mulch last year - they still grew through about 3/4 inch of the mulch). If you're digging them out of the lawn, the lawn has to be damp from rain or a THOROUGH watering. I've had success with a dandelion weeder/spear. It's really more a "prying them out of the ground" process than "picking".

4a. Hand pulling with regular garden gloves won't work as well. Try latex medical/food prep gloves (they're more durable than you would expect). That will let you get a better "feel" of the bulb when you're burying your finger in the soil let you know if sure you're getting the whole thing, and not snapping it in 1/2.

4b. You said they leave a hole? Are you actually using a shovel to dig them out?

5. Current state of my lawn - This year, I haven't noticed that many of them. I re-seeded last fall, and I believe the thicker lawn (and the higher cut when I mow) is either a.) shading them out so that they aren't growing as quickly or b.) hiding them so well it's tough to find them unless they showing off their purple flowers. If you haven't raised your mowing height yet, that would be my first suggestion.

6. Seeds? I haven't noticed any seeds - I thought they spread by rhizomes? It could be both - I have not researched them lately. I always assumed it was just sprouting new "colonies" due to their extensive root systems (which I only have success pulling in the rose beds - they're too fragile to pull successfully from the lawn)

7. I copied and saved a posting from someone (maybe garden forum? not sure), that mentioned 90% weed control after 2 spraying in 3 weeks. He used weed-b-gon Chickweed, clover and oxalis killer. It supposedly has some form of triclopyr that is suitable for lawn use. No personal experience here, just passing along previously read information.

8. The other research I saved on violets mentioned that violets like a lower pH. But again, it's just a posters comment, no hard reasearch or facts to back it up.

Hope this book helps.

Gags

The other research I saved on violets mentioned that violets like a lower pH. But again, it's just a posters comment, no hard reasearch or facts to back it up.

They do just fine at 7.0.

Maybe it's a Northern thing, but most of us look at violets as being favored by nature, like hummingbirds. Neither are so common here as to be unremarkable. I had one in the gardens that I kept feeding, but it didn't make it through the winter.

I doubt that the Weed Hound will get it all in one pull, but I think it's going to give it a good setback. This is the Wrong Forum to suggest other controls...

Great review, gags. Someone else had a question about creeping charlie and violets. Looks like both of them have similar root systems. I found a message from someone who had success eradicating CC with a spading fork and turning up the entire garden to get all the roots out.

If you have had success by mowing higher, that is good info, too. Some weeds will adjust to the new height and grow higher themselves, but some won't.

I agree with you about vinegar, light, AND heat. When we have a sunny day, it is a hot day at the same time, so I would not necessarily notice that.

Thanks everyone. Thanks for sharing your personal experience gags. The seeds are forming now, the capsules are underneath the leaves so they fall straight down. It's like my grey hair - pull one out and two grow in its place.

I'm just browsing the forums, picking up bits of information, and my way of dealing with violets might not resonate well on this forum, but I have just simply made friends with them and declared a unilateral cease-fire. They are the official state flower here, after all. :)

Oxalis is is another former "enemy" I have made peace with.

To be honest, for me turf is just something to separate various plantings, although I do want it to look decent.

Yes, I am the other poster with the wild violet and ground ivy problem. We have been dealing with it here for 2-3 years. Last year we killed the lawn and started over, there were just too many. We have much fewer now, but they are still beginning to work their way into bare spots and over from the neighbors entirely wild violet lawn! I have a flower bed that I completely turned with a shovel and picked through with my hands and thought I got all the root systems out. With in a few weeks the bed was completely covered with them again....grrrr! I hate them.
We have also been growing our grass at longer lengths, we need to really work on the quality of the soil and see if that will help. But they grow through ANYTHING! With that flower bed, I ended up just completely covering it with landscape cloth and planting through it and putting mulch on top. That was the only way I could keep them out of the bed. They still grow up through the lattice around the patio.
I have read that the best time to "get" them is when they are young, early in the season. Once they get more established in mid summer they are impossible.

I too have tried the vinegar, but as pp mentioned, I don't think it really gets the root system. Maybe some boiling water in select places that won't touch other plants!
We plan to just keep digging at them and keep filling in with some seed this fall to try to keep them crowded out, in addition to trying to improve soil conditions.

If you find any solutions! Please share them!!!!!!

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