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purpleinopp

Found ants in the leaf pockets between trunk

Sorry, I don't know the technical anatomical term, but I found ants between the leaf crotches and the trunk. I took this plant to this sink for a drink and noticed a couple of ants on it. No big deal, bringing over 100 pots inside recently, there's gonna be a few critters.

I stood there watching for a few minutes and noticed they weren't coming from the soil (common if they're in the soil when I water - the only place I've seen ants on house plants unless they were farming aphids) but going in/out of the crotches/pockets of space between the lowest 2 leaves and the trunk, never did see any coming out of the soil. Just above these 2 leaves was the hardened brown stump of a leaf removed months ago. I was using the hose attachment on our shower to try to flush those pockets out but decided removing the leaves would be necessary to finish removing the stump of that old leaf, and see what in the world is going on in there.

I've removed as much as I can without scratching hard enough to fear damage to the trunk. There doesn't seem to be any actual damage to the trunk, no soft spots or holes. The rest of the dead stuff looks soft because it's wet but it's not. I'll try removing the rest of it when it dries more.

Never seen anything like that before, and am now not sure if this tree is OK or not. Thoughts?

Comments (16)

  • Tiffany, purpleinopp Z8b Opp, AL
    Original Author
    11 years ago

    Not sure what kind of palm it is, either... This is not where it usually sits while inside.

  • Tiffany, purpleinopp Z8b Opp, AL
    Original Author
    11 years ago

    There's no white stuff on the trunk, the flash kept doing that...

  • Tiffany, purpleinopp Z8b Opp, AL
    Original Author
    11 years ago

    The trunk is much thinner where all of this occurred...

  • tropicbreezent
    11 years ago

    I wouldn't worry about it, happens here a lot. Especially since the palms are outdoors which is a mega-antopolis. Sometimes ants will extend their living quarters up to get away from too much moisture. Here the natural cycle for a lot of them is in the wet season move up into trees, etc., to avoid floods. Dry season move back down into the ground because we have the seasonal fires then. If they're not farming aphids, mealybugs, or the like then it's not a problem. Also just check that they're not the leaf-cutter ants either. Then if anyone asks just say it's your formicarium.

  • Tiffany, purpleinopp Z8b Opp, AL
    Original Author
    11 years ago

    Thanks!

    "formicarium" - had to look that up, good word for ant farm. Hope I remember it. If they're in there breeding, I guess it would be a fornicarium.

    Don't think I mentioned above, this was the first time this plant was watered since it came inside in late Nov. They do that here, too, go UP when it rains. Sometimes into my car. That's frustrating. This just seemed totally different, and the trunk looks weird there. The tree doesn't seem unhappy though, making the flowers and a new leaf...

  • Tiffany, purpleinopp Z8b Opp, AL
    Original Author
    11 years ago

    I think this tree has scale. Is this scale? Whatever these brown bumps on the stem are, they weren't there yesterday, I spent about 20 minutes studying it yesterday and today, so I know for sure they weren't. Takes no effort to move them, so I'm confused...

  • Tiffany, purpleinopp Z8b Opp, AL
    Original Author
    11 years ago

    Under a leaf.

  • Tiffany, purpleinopp Z8b Opp, AL
    Original Author
    11 years ago

    Well I spent about an hour yesterday with this plant, removed that last pictured leaf, got q-tips and rubbing alcohol and rubbed away all of that rotted residue, those brown bumps, and generally cleaned the trunk and petioles really well.

    I didn't see any more of those brown spots on the other leaves, but the way each leaflet curls into a "U" where it attaches, this is a really hard plant to inspect.

    Not that I don't inspect all plants anyway, but am still curious if those spots looked like scale. There are a LOT of plants in here for winter in close quarters...

  • tropicalzone7
    11 years ago

    Your palm is a parlor palm! I woudnt worry too much about the ants, they are a part of bringing plants indoors for the winter and they wont do any damage to the plants. Its hard to tell if you have scale or spidermites, but if you do, add a few drops of neem oil and soap to water and spray it all over the plant. It's safe for pets and humans and very effective in killing a lot of pests (I have personally used neem oil for aphids, spider mites, whiteflies, mealy bugs, and scale with success. I used to have to deal with those pests every single year indoors now they arent around at all (just a few mealy bugs I have to take care of).

    Good luck!
    -Alex

  • tropicbreezent
    11 years ago

    Yes, those are scale. Most people deal with them as you have. The thing with neem oil is that often it doesn't react immediately, which some poeple expect. It does interupt the breeding cycle of insects. So although you might still see adults around for a while there won't be any progeny. And because their life cycle is so short the adults will disappear anyway.

  • Tiffany, purpleinopp Z8b Opp, AL
    Original Author
    11 years ago

    Thanks for the replies! I don't want to buy any stuff if not necessary. The alcohol did a great job on what I could see with these old eyes.

    There are swarms of ants that go in and out of pots while outside, but I've never seen ants setup shop within the anatomy of a plant, they colonize in the soil. I think they are in cahoots with the scale, just like aphids. The only times I've seen ants on plants before is if they're farming aphids, or if they are fleeing flood waters (from watering.)

    I don't think they do any harm to a plant (although I don't know what they might be doing to the roots when they colonize soil,) their presence indicates the strong possibility there are plant pests present. The next time I see ants on a plant, I'll be more suspicious.

    Don't know what this tree is, but it is not a Chamaedorea elegans. The most obvious difference to me is the way the leaflets attach to the petiole. On C. elegans, the leaflets are almost completely flat where they attach. On this tree, the attachment is U-shaped. C. elegans trunks are bumpy, this one is smooth.

  • tropicalzone7
    11 years ago

    The trunk and inflorescences look very similar to my Chamaedorea elegans, the main difference I can see is the frond arrangement. I figured it was because of the light exposure it was in, but it could be a different species. It definitely looks like a Chamaedorea of some type to me, not sure of any other chamaedoreas species that it could be, but there are a few C. elegans look-a-likes
    -Alex

  • tropicbreezent
    11 years ago

    I've never examined C. elegans that closely but Chanaedoreas can be variable. I have a number of C. seifrizii and some do look quite different to the others, as in leaflet width/length and frond length. Other than that, I can't think what other Chamaedorea it might be. Although, there are a lot of species.

  • Tiffany, purpleinopp Z8b Opp, AL
    Original Author
    11 years ago

    Yeah, I don't know... My neighbor gave me this tree last summer. I know extremely little about palms. I've had a big pot of multiple C. elegans for a couple decades and this tree is just different, but not much...

    Another difference is the girth of the trunk. It's almost twice as fat as any of the other palms, some of which are significantly taller. This tree also can take a LOT more light without burning the leaves, quite a bit of direct sun. The fronds seem a lot more stiff (and shorter) whereas C. elegans fronds wave easily in the wind.

    Oh well, as long as I can keep the pests off of it, its' proper name isn't really important. Being in a pot and sometimes inside probably prevents these house plant trees from looking/performing/growing as they would in a natural setting. There's always curiosity, though...

    Thanks a lot for the replies!!

  • joey_powell
    11 years ago

    Hello purpleinopp. I'm located in Enterprise!

  • Tiffany, purpleinopp Z8b Opp, AL
    Original Author
    11 years ago

    Hey, that's cool! I used to work over there. Maybe we could swap some stuff this spring.

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