I have several species of Phoenix growing in containers (canariensis, sylvestris, roebelini, reclinata, and dactylifera). Personally, the only difference I see in growth rate is with the dactylifera (true date). I find it slower growing than the other species. Just don't notice any faster growth on the sylvestris compared to the other varieties. Actually, I find canariensis to be quite robust in its rate of growth (for a palm). Of all the species I maintain, it is the only one that has graduated to a 50 gallon tub (though the Washingtonia robustas are getting there fast). In any event, sylvestris is a hardy palm (with good drought tolerance) and built to last.

I think most phoenix species are pretty slow when compared to some others.

Most of the phoenix palms youll run into around here are Canary's. Although alot of the higher end houses and business will plant true dates. For a good example of true dates near you look at the entrances to baybrook mall. Most of the "pineapple" trunked phoenix palms you will see are true dates.

I cant think off the top of my head of where there are any silver dates up near houston.... Houston palm tree gets some in their stock sometimes so that may be an option. to be honest silver dates are pretty rare in our area for some reason but, they are one of my favorite phoenix to look at.

The silver date palm will generally be trimmed in such a way that it sort of resembles a butia, except the newest trimmed petioles will often be an orangeish color.

this palm is pretty similar to what we see around here for silver dates.

If you look at this pic, the taller date palms in the pic are true dates so maybe this will help with your ID's

As for growth rate, Im only speaking from visual experiences with local palms as Im not personally growing any larger phoenix species (although I have a spot picked out for a silver date palm) all of the phoenix species start out slowly and most of them pick up quite a bit of speed except for the lowly canary... it pretty much stays the same all the time.

I bet that there are CIDP's here on the island that are over 100years old (I bet some of them have 60' or more of clear trunk)

Galveston

I BET YOU WOULD HAVE REALY HAD SOME NICE PALMS IF IT WEREN'T FOR THOSE NASTY HURRICANES !

actually, most palms are fine in hurricanes, considering how often we get them its not bad at all... our big trouble in palms is wind... even at 75%+ humidity a constant 15-25mph wind desicates palm leaves badly. add to that the super freezes we get about every 20 years and I live in a very frustrating palm spot!

most years we could grow just about anything (sans cocos)that can be grown in central florida down to all but deep south florida. but about every 20 years ma nature resets the landscape as she sees fit!

back to the topic... here is a local pic of some silver dates that I think are awesomely planted (not to mention the royals that are located on the property !)

Our experience here in N. Florida is that P. sylvestris and its cross w/ P. canariensis grow quite fast

I have Phoenix sylvestris and sylvestris robusta. I also have theophrasti,reclinata, and loureiri var. humilis. Loureiri var. humilis is the slowest and the sylvestris varieties aren't much better. Theophrasti and reclinata are growing two to three times faster. TRANSLATION=every time the slow pokes put out a little leaf the faster guys put out 2 or 3 leaves.

Yeah those are gorgeous !

By the way galveston
How is your foxtail ?

merril,

where can one find a P. sylvestris X canariensis? Where in north florida are you located?

Luke

Hi, Luke:
I'm at Forest Grove, FL, between Newberry and Alachua, but spend some time at Gainesville, where my son takes care of my palms. Because of death of some breeding parents, I only have a few fairly large[aprox. 5-15 gal] canariensis X sylvestris. There are quite a few can X sylv in two locations in Betrocks "Plant Finder" Let me know if you don't have access, and I'll try to get it to you.

I just got back from Singapore and there are these grey date palms planted all around the waterfront areas. i think theyre sylvestris but maybe they are Phoenix taiwaniana , they have thin trunks and pretty short leaves. I dont like em, in that climate why arent they planting more exotic/attractive things!?

Could be just a matter of local "tastes" perhaps and they find them to their liking there? Perhaps they're easier than some other more atrractive varieties? Feng Shui perhaps?

Maybe they're trying to make it look like vegas? Spikes are bad for feng shui but maybe. They love the "instant garden" look over there and most things are staked upright and look like they've just been planted so maybe they're the best mature things they could get. If it were me however i'd have gone with fijian fans.

how to tell between a canary and a silver date,thanks mark

Silver date palm is silvery bluish green and canary is green. I had a 3-4 foot tall planted in ground and it got 22F one night and it did not make it in spring it was all dead.

Silver is also even more prickly than canariensis--especially at leaf tips.

Most of these Phoenix palms in America are hybrids so you never quite know what you are getting and they will show varying characteristics. For Sylvestris look for a lovely powder silver blue as (they can vary in colour from grey green, blue green, green, to strikingly silver), plumose leaves (like a fox tail) with relatively stiff wide short leaflets. Anything else is veering too much towards another phoenix. They do grow fairly rapily for a Phoenix and respond very well to watering and fertiliser. They also thrive in high humidity along with the dwarf Phoenix roebelenii, where others will succumb to fungal problems. They are beutifull even when young which is a big bonus. P. reclinata grows the fastest but is clumping, you also wont find one that is not a hybrid in America, the hybrid is also pretty fast.

That's become my favorite palm I never planted. So unappreciated in dry California too. None of the palm planting posts on the net of planting here in California even mention the Phoenix species let alone the Silver Date.

btw,I do have a P.lourii..and forget it. A slug and as water needy as any rainforest palm. That was not a good purchase it turns out, in 2009.

Yes it's a beauty. I think with the ever growing selection of palms available people tend to get confused and plant something they've never heard of before and be disappointed with the result and effect.

A good form of P. Sylvestris is a gorgeous thing. It's well worth taking the time to select for the characteristics that make it so lovely. A little grove of intense silvery blue Sylvestris is more evocative of place and more effective than hundreds of mixed species no matter how rare. If you are lucky and can afford, choose trunking specimens. You will immiedetly see there are differences in leaf arrangement colour and outline, so you may have to select from various growers. In younger palms this is also apparent, don't think something will turn powder blue or silver as it matures it won't, generaly what you see is what it will be with these. The only difference is with seedlings they all tend to be dark green but by the time there are at least ten to twelve leaves on a juvenile the colour is apparent so that's the size to do your selecting if going for little ones. Choose leaflets that are broad and short and have a plumose arrangement on the mid rib. Thin long narrow leaflets don't look so attractive on a mature palm even if a nice silver colour. The leaflet attachment to the mid rib should however be narrow or you are looking at a possible hybrid with a date palm. This will mean a slower growing fatter and less attractive palm, also avoid anything with fat leaf bases, Sylvestris bases are flat, strap like.

The nice thing about them is it's never too late to plant one as they look just as lovely as a small fecund fountain of leaves as they do as mature adults. They have many leaves making a very nice full head. If you have small dogs and children it might be wise to choose your planting site carefully as they have quite sharp thorns.

The other fantastic thing about them is that unlike most Phoenix they are very happy in high humidity and retain their colour just as well as a dry climate if not even better. So if you are in the tropics it will still thrive and look good. In fact they positively explode with regular watering and feeding, in cooler weather or during your dry season keep on the dry side to give them a rest, this encourages a deeper root system. Think of each leaf as a food storage organ, the more the stronger it will be, so only cut off when the leaf is completely dead and when doing so don't cut into any living white tissue because the sap could attract boring insects.

P. lourii is a lovely Palm too. However most people tend to think because it's a Phoenix it thrives in dry arid climates and icy wet winters. However this is not so. It thrives in seasonally very high humid summer rainfall areas where it's much faster growing and more rewarding, it prefers a dry cool winter. Definitely more sub-tropical than tropical but not an arid wet winter species at all. Most you see depicted on the net and growing in parks and botanical gardens are hybrids including palmpedia. The trunk is always narrow and delicate looking only slightly thicker (and much taller) than a P. Roebelenii and smooth, the long bright green leaves with leaflets on a single plain make a lovely full head and have a characteristic arching twist to them.

Happy hunting.

Thats a very handy trait. Though I cant work out why this should be so. I know most Phoenix species develop an incredible, vast root system and unlike most palms if a root is cut it tends to branch rather than dies back to the main trunk. Thats why digging them up and transplanting is so much easier than many other palms. They also can cover a large area with finer quite shllow feeder roots that also suck up brief rain water from a large area so don't rely so much on those big thick numbers that maybe gophers find the juiciest and yummy. The thick roots tend to go straight down looking for the water table. If you're watering well maybe thats why the gophers dont get a chance to kill them. Bizmarckias hate any kind of root disturbance.

I have four big three year old lourii in pots, no trunk yet. The ten or so others much older and trunking are in the ground. As far as I can tell though and I know this sounds very strange but growth rate, as far as pushing out leaves looks to be faster in the pots. I just dont have a clue why. Maybe they prefer being pot bound for some reason. The ones in the ground though are throwing more mature bigger leaves, nice shiny green wider leaflets that take longer to produce maybe. They do seem to like a lot of water and food and respond noticeably well to doses of high nitrogen, high potassium fert, usualy means a spurt of three or four leaf spears starting to open.

gophers in my area must be more desperate… had one palm that had been in the ground nearly a year get its roots chewed back nearly to nothing (palm began rocking)… amazingly I dug it up, moved it (into a wire basked this time) and its still alive (no idea what roots look like now… i don't feel like digging it up again).

I haven't noticed any gopher damage in my very small yard to Howea's or King palms or a Trachycarpus. One gopher devoured a 20+ year old clump of C. costaricana right between the Trachy and Howea.

The list of what they have ate is one long list. Its why that yard has large old plants with small plants in pots...and not much in between. The large are either bad tasting or have enough roots to live on. The small protected in their pots...and the middle sized plants are rare. Cane Begonia's,ferns.

My variegated Monstera I planted summer of 2014? The base was eaten and its survived on aerial roots!..weird to see the base 2" from the ground.

Wow gophers sound like trouble. Can you fumigate or exterminate them or are they a protected species? Sounds like you guys need some pythons. What's up with their natural predators?