I use a soil-less mix like Pro Mix and plant the seeds without pretreatment in small cell trays which are paced on a heat mat without lights

As the seed germinate I move the seedlings to 72 cell trays in the same potting mix and under lights ( ordinary 40 watt flourescents)

As they grow I move them to deep cell trays and they stay under lights

I then continue to move them to larger containers as needed to accomodate different growth rates until it is warm enough to put them outside

and them they get hardened off by being outside for increasing amounts of time

Pro Mix or Jiffy Mix is about as good as it gets.

Neat set-up John. I hope that is a spare bedroom. Being silly, I know. I use the small plastic Dixie cups with holes in the bottom, two or three seeds to a cup and sprout in a warm place. I use a potting soil that is made in Tx so that is probably no help at all. After sprouting, move to lights, just regular shop lights with 40 watt bulbs. Thin to the best plant or separate and transplant to other cups and grow. I use plastic cat litter boxes to hold the cups under the lights. No drips or spills that way.

John great setup! So you start with that 120 cell tray (as shown) and then you individually transplant each cell into a 72 cell tray? Seems like a lot of work. Also doens't look like it's much bigger of a cell to risk damaging roots, unless I am misunderstanding you there.

So basically you stick with Pro Mix for the life of the plant?

My setup is much like John's (looks like exact same shelving) minus the neatness factor. Switched to ProMix several years back and have never had a damp-off problem. Sometimes a green mold may form on soil mix surface and I couldn't care less as is harmless.

I use clear plastic seed tray domes with holes punched in sides for initial sprouting. This keeps the humidity up and I spray my surface sowed seeds only as needed, usually every two or three days.

John also where do you find those 120 cell trays and 72 cell deep trays? Thanks.

I just looked up Pro Mix BX. What is the best price on this in the US and where can I find this?

Also considering it is only made of Spaghnum Peat Moss, vermiculite and perlite, I am wondering why is the mix that I make any different besides that I add Miracle grow to it? Also what would the proper ratio to make a close approximation of Pro Mix I have heard it is expensive.

Last since there is Sphagnum Peat Moss in Pro Mix won't it still turn green and get soggy and draw the fungus gnats (which I assume is the reason I have that problem, since I added Spagnum Peat Moss to my mix)?

I get Pro Mix BX at the Blue Seal feed store or a local hardware for $19.95 for a compressed 3.8 cf bale. You can also find it some places in uncompreesed bags but it is quite a bit more expensive that way. I used to make my own mix but it didn't save me much money and was a lot more work. I use it straight inside but add bagged composted cow manure for the mix which goes into the pots outside ( I grow all of them in pots). I never have a problem with fungus gnats outside. Inside they are mostly just annoying ( The larve may cause damage in large quantities but not the adults)and can be controlled by just letting the soil surface dry out completely between waterings. I also use a similar product--Fafard #2 which has a bit more perlite than the Pro Mix which gives better drainage but therefore does not hold as much water.

John

I guess I'll have to continue to make my own mix for a while until I can find a cheap source for Pro Mix, or for that matter even FIND a place that carries this stuff down here. One place that can order it was like wanting $39.99 for the 3.8 compressed I was like WHAT!!!! I see it online for about the same prices John mentioned maybe a few bucks more low $20's. What kind of price gouging is selling a $20 retail item for $39.99? Only in Florida I guess ....

About $22 here.

Here is a link that might be useful: retail locator

PkapeckOpickldpepprz

Promix appears to be a northern item.

In the south you might find Farfar's(sp)

West coast, Kellogs mix is about the same thing

Thanks John and Byron. John, no retail locations within 100 miles which is the max Premier will let you enter for finding a retailer.

Byron, I will check out farfars. Thanks for the lead.

I believe it is spelled 'Fafard'.

I believe it is spelled 'Fafard'.

Link below says not to use peat.

Here is a link that might be useful: Hot pepper growing tips from Redwood City

Honu, that's why I started this thread actually. I also talked to Craig on the phone from Redwood seeds as I mentioned in this thread

http://forums.gardenweb.com/forums/load/pepper/msg122050217959.html?15

and he suggested Miracle Grow and Perlite. But seeing John has had good luck with Pro Mix that's what I am after. And as luck would have it a Landscape Supply Company has it here (not even 5 miles from the place that wanted to charge $40.00 a bag) for $22.00. I bought a 3.8 bag and it will last a longgggg time. Especially if only used for seed starting. It seems like this is the secret piece of the puzzle as it has high water retention but the perlite keeps it nice and well drained. I think this will be my best growing year ever. Thanks everyone for your help!

Pka, Thanks for the link. That was an interesting discussion. I wish I could find Pro Mix too. I hear lots of good things about it, but I haven't found it in our state. However, I have had good results w/ Gardener & Bloome, with added perlite, even if it does contain some peat according to the ingredients list. I wrote more about it in the thread you linked above.
Good luck!

I don't know where "that don't use peat" thing came from. Pro Mix, Fafard and many other mixes are based on peat and have worked fine for me for many years. The nurseries around here all use these mixes too.

John

I used a potting mix primarily made up of peat. It also has perlite, vermiculite, and wetting agents.

This year I am using Pro-Mix Bx since I got a 3.8 Cu Ft. bag (compressed) for $22 from a local nursery. This was used last season and I had pretty good success germinating seeds.

I too am not sure why Redwood so strongly advises against peat. However, if you review their "germinating seeds" instructions this season on their webpage versus what was posted last season, they have changed some things on their page. Not huge changes, but some differences.

Chris

In this photo, the row on the left is Mirical Gro mix, the rest is pro mix

Maybe folks can find Scotts pro mix, It was Peters redi earth

its a little more expensive Last time I priced it, it was 16.95 for 2.8 cu ft.

Here is a link that might be useful:

Isn't Redwood City supposed to be "organic"? Pure organic folks don't like peat for anything. They say it is "dead" and doesn't contain nutrients. If you are only going to sprout seeds and then repot to a potting soil, I don't see that it would hurt, especially if you can sprout seeds in paper towels.

I don't see how that "dead" arguement works for peat not being organic. I use tons of stuff that is dead.

Compost is made of dead crap. Leaves, grass clippings, banana peels, egg shells, coffee grinds, manure, potatoe skins. All these things are dead or dying but were created organically.

My understanding of organic growing was no manufactured chemicals. It's not like some dude whipped up peat in a laboratory. Also it seems practically everything in my organic fertilizer used to be alive, but I kinda doubt it is now, cause it's ground up and dry in a plastic bag.

What is missing is the stripping of peat bogs in Canada, This causes Moose to move south and become a hazard to man.

Peat does not replenish as fast as the harvesters claim

PkapeckOpickldpepprz

Sorry I missed your question. Don't remember where I got the 120 cell trays but the deep cell trays came from Lee Valley. I use both sizes and like them a lot--they allow met to replant my seedlings deeper and get nice root balls

Here is a link that might be useful: Lee Valley

Whatever you do, I suggest you DON'T transplant your seedlings into the Jiffy peat pots. I used them last year and had the sorriest group of wimpy, wet-feet plants you ever saw. Only a few recovered after planting.
John

John47, nice looking baby plant there. Any idea how old that is? Seems to take a while before mine get that big from seedlings, but they are slowly geting to that stage (some of them).

Don't have notes on that specific plant because it was a late start. But look at the picture of the plants above in the deep cell tray-taken 5/12/05 and those are from seeds sown 4/13/05.

john

Ok so about a month to get mature leaf sets. I guess I just get impatient. haha.

IÂm sure for most people "best" means optimal. For me, best means cheap & easy. I just use regular potting soil for sprouting, transplanting and in the raised garden beds or pots.

Hmm, about a month ago, I transplanted my new sprouts to potting soil mixed with lot of coir (in place of my usual perlite), since I heard lot of good things about coir improving drainage and aeration. The seedlings are still alive, but haven't grown at all. Very strange! They are getting lot of sunlight and regular watering and our daytime temps are nice and warm. I might have to repot them all to my usual planting mix plus added perlite.
Does anyone have experience with coir?

pkapeckopickldpepprz

Found a source for the small cell trays and they have free shipping this month on web orders

Here is a link that might be useful: High Mowing