i dont think the right term is seed ...

but i hope you didnt just cut all the spores off a healthy plant...

see link ...

please also link us to your other post ..

let me know if i guessed right????

ken

Here is a link that might be useful: link

Hi Ken! I'm confused now since you also replied to both of my listings. I meant to answer this in the garden clinic forum but answered you instead in the houseplant. I'm deleting my posts in the houseplant forum and keeping to this forum for help.

Thanks for your reply, but no. I've had many ferns for years so I'm familiar with the spores. However, none of my ferns came down with this problem before. This is DEFINITELY soft brown scale. Looks exactly like all the pictures I've seen on google images of the juveniles and females. They create 'honeydew', they peel off easily and young are waxy. I looked at them through a jewelers loupe to note their anatomy. So the ID is not in question. I cut off the fronds because they were completely bombarded by the little blighters and I could see no better way to take off dozens at a time without the benefit of know-how on other ways to kill them off.

you wouldnt have been the first to cut off spore.. lol ...

any chance at a pic?

i treat all my house plants.. outside ....in early fall.. in MI ... with systemic soil based granules ... ... to avoid all the winter bug problems ...

if i ran into your nightmare .. on a beloved plant... i would do it indoors ... it would smell.. but one pot wont be over whelming.. and on some level.... lol .. it would be the smell of certain death.. and make me happy ... lol

yes.. i found your other post ... i dont know why you deleted it.. or how ... but why not get info from other sources ...

good luck

ken

The point is, I have soft brown scale (Coccus hesperidum) on my fern. No question there. I have researched it and found that most insecticides don't kill it and those that do, do not do a thorough job so reinfestation is probable. What do I specifically do to get rid of this specific pest without destroying the plant?

I have read that you must coat every leaf in insecticide **oil** to suffocate the critters. You must do every leaf because many crawlers are not easily seen. This is not feasible with a fern of this size where I can't even reach the center of the fern because it's so thick. I'm looking for people who have experienced this scale problem and will have other, more helpful advice. I find nothing more on the internet. The greenhouses in the area have no advice and it makes me wonder what they would do if they caught them??

I'll take a few pictures when I go in today so you can see I know what the difference between a spore and a scale is. lol

first and second links at the link below ...

as i said ... i dont mind the chems in this limited situation ....

if you dont wish to use such.. in your house ... others will chime in ... but as you note ... hitting every leaf of a giant BF might be challenging ...

keep in mind.. scale is a very remedy specific problem ... many insecticides will not deal with such ... as it cant get thru the cover ...

and crawlers are only in that stage.. for a very short period of time ... they arent there.. 24/7/365 .....

hence why i prefer.. attacking.. from the sucking side ...

ken

Here is a link that might be useful: link

Don't worry about a picture. It's clear that you know what you're seeing are scale insects. The honeydew is a pretty big clue!

Trillium, not only can scale insects be a real pain to control on houseplants as a general rule, but a scale infestation on FERNS is a nightmare. Ferns can be very, very sensitive about oil based pesticides, including any of the horticultural oils.

There are some systemic pesticides that are labeled for indoor use. I don't use them and can't speak to their efficacy. The best forum for information regarding that would have been the Houseplant Forum, lol.

I do not recommend that you use a pesticide not recommended for indoor use on any houseplant. You don't really want to "do whatever you have to", you must find a completely safe solution when children are present. The odor from a pesticide should be a warning.

I've had big Boston ferns in the past. I found that the only practical solution for me was to give the plants a crew cut, spray the remaining stubble with hort. oil, and let the new growth grow back clean and strong.

In the future, know that it's fine for you to post in different forums, especially if you are unsure of where you might obtain the most helpful responses. Be sure to let me know if I can be of further help.

Hi Rhizo!

Thanks so much for the invaluable information. I've never had to give a fern a complete crew cut - eek! Obviously, I'll do it if that's the best way to deal with this problem (which is sounds like it is). But as I've never done it before, any advice would be greatly appreciated. Is this something I can do now in the winter or do you think (seeing that the scale seems to be a relatively slow pest) I should watch if the fern can tough it out with the pests until spring?

I've grown fern in g'house settings and rhizo pretty much summed up what I was going to say. Ferns and oil are a dicey proposition and believe it or not, a boston fern should be quite OK to grow back from a severe haircut. Here's what else I would do. It would be just a fantastic time to completely rejuvenate it. Old ferns gets so much dead fronds toward the center, that when you trim them off, it just leaves nekkid brown stubs. They also tend to eventually get so rootbound that you find new growth coming out the from the drain holes and along the pot sides. I'd take it out to a garage or other protected area, put down some newspapers and dump it out of the pot, saw the danged thing in four quarters, take the foliage down close to the roots and dip what is left of the foliage in a bucket of hort oil/water mixed to the recommended proportions and replant it in fresh media and enjoy four ferns. I usually do my fern divisions late december for hanging baskets, and they're decently filled by spring and vigorous. Scale is nasty, if a plant is trim-able, the easiest and most successful way to deal with it, is cut back as far as you dare, get all the infected plant material cleaned up and treat what little stem and foliage is left. I got rid of the scale on a heavily infested bed of purple leaf winter creeper that way and only had to treat it once. That was twenty years ago and the scale t never came back.

this is the first time... i have ever seen rhiz agree to the use of a systemic product ...

go figure on that ...

ken

Thanks for the advice, Calliope. I'm on it today. Poor fern doesn't know what's coming! lol

What systemic, Ken? Hort oil is not a systemic.

Maybe Ken thinks that because I used 'systemic' in a sentence that I was suggesting its use? I very frequently encourage the use of a horticultural oil, of which there are many these days.

Ken, I very rarely recommend the use of strong synthetic insecticides because they are so often misused, creating a hazardous situation for innocent consumers. Just as importantly, in my mind, is the fact that they often are not necessary.

But I am not against the use of pesticides, when used appropriately. As ken knows, I have permanent liver damage caused by exposure to a pesticide; I cannot use those products or even be around them. My knowledge of such chemicals has become scant....thus, I never suggest their use.

I do try to help people discover the identity of their plant problems, so that they can make educated, informed decisions.

I'm not shy about scolding someone who uses pesticides recklessly or who promotes hazardous off label use.

Trillium, I'm glad that Calliope mentioned dividing the fern. I don't know how long you've had yours but they have very aggressive root systems. They really need to be divided frequently. I usually cut them back before bringing them inside, then divide in the spring.

TrilliumFae, at the risk of "...painting the lily..." here might be a useful link.

Thanks, Ronalawn. :) Wish I had found that when I was digging originally, but I got pretty good advice here so I can't complain. Still - good eye!

I already acted on Rhizo and Calliope's advice and my fern is sporting a rather sad crew cut. I'm a loss to the salon industry. ;) I didn't have time to divide it today, but I did treat the rest of the plant in hort oil because I couldn't stand the idea of allowing the scale room to breath after the cut.

The oil is great - no nasty fumes! I've had lung issues in the past and don't wish to relive them, so I'm glad for something effective that isn't overly dangerous to my health. And I'm happy that the kids that come to the studio tomorrow won't be at risk by anything harsh (I would have moved the plant out of the studio if I had to of course!)

What's the general advice after treating with an oil like this? Should I treat again in a few days? The bottle, although contains a booklet of instructions for usage, does not give frequency. I would think that one dose should do it?

I've never cut back a fern like this before so I'm not sure about how to nurse this one back to vitality. Will the hort oil need rinsing? Or business as usual?

Thanks for all the help -

The oil does not require rinsing. I'm very surprised that application intervals were not given as part of the instructions.

How about give me the exact brand name so I can search some instructions on line?

I usually just monitor plants closely for awhile after an oil application, and unless they get a new infestation moving in from somewhere else, don't think I've ever had to do a second. The beauty of oils, if applied carefully to the whole foliar surface area is that they kill all stages of development, from egg to adult. That is not the case with many other pesticides where the pesticide may only be effective against certain life stages of an insect. If you can eradicate the pest in all of it's stages from egg to maturity, there are none left to repeat the life cycle necessitating another treatment.

rhiz, et al ....

this was the first time [that i know of] ... you stated that the use.. of a proper indoor systemic ... was an option ... that was my only point ....

your remedy was to give it a severe haircut .. and then oil it ... which would have been my second option ...

but OP said she didnt want to do that.. initially anyway ...

frankly.. its a BFern ... rather than spend a penny on it... i would throw it out the back door on this 20 degree MI day ... and go buy another for 10 bucks... before i would go spend 20 on trying to cure it.. in the meantime.. potentially infecting other plants in the house ..

a safe.. non toxic option ...

ken

BFerns respond beautifully and rapidly to being severely cut back. Seems silly to toss when it will be prettier than ever in a few months. I pick my battles carefully, and this fern is probably worth a tiny bit of effort for a predictably great result.

A little bottle of hort oil is probably less than seven dollars. She'd only need a few tablespoons to treat her fern. It's one of those things any serious gardener should have on their shelf, and it will last indefinitely, to be handy down the line. Her one fern could be four lovely ferns in a matter of months, and the pruning, dividing and re-potting will give it a new lease on life, and as many new pots of ferns as she'd care to have. People who throw plants away like they're disposable is what kept people like me in business for decades. ;-)

This post was edited by calliope on Tue, Jan 6, 15 at 21:28

Ken, there's been many a time when I've yanked a plant without a second thought. It doesn't even have to be infested with pests....just being hopelessly ugly qualifies for removal, lol.

The very first thing we did when we moved into this home was to yank a couple of awful trees from the front yard; we couldn't share the real estate with such homely things.

So, there's a time and a place for getting rid of a plant. This isn't one of them. I would even call this effort for a fern as routine maintenance. Top and bottom pruning is a rejuvenation procedure, not just for ferns but other containerized plants, as well.