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Good Container Growers

Posted by AllanRandall z7 OKC (My Page) on
Thu, Mar 28, 13 at 20:40

Last season I got a lot of advice everyone here on the forum and ended up getting a Penang Peach. It is the start of a new season and I'm having that moment that I'm sure most of you went through, the realization that you can't stop at just one.

I'm hoping that some of you wouldn't mind giving some recommendations of some good container growers. I'm not necessarily looking for tiny like Divine, but I don't want tall and lanky either. Has to be a heat lover and would love good blooming with a great fragrance.

I've been looking at Waimea or Kauka Wilder... not sure about their habit though.


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Good Container Growers

The flower of Waimea has more substance and lasting power than that of Kauka Wider...atleast for me...I am in Ventura, Ca. roxanne


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Thanks for the quick response,Roxanne. I actually like the look of Waimea better as well. However, I read a few fragrance threads that had Kauka Wilder listed as a coconut smell, which sounds very appealing. I haven't been able to find much about the smell of Waimea. Does it smell pretty good and do you think it will do well in a container?


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My Waimea hasn't bloomed yet, but I think it's supposed to smell very sweet. I do know that the two I've rooted were as easy as could be to root, and that means a lot in my book! However, someone with more experience will have to say whether it's a tall grower.

The Kauka Wilder I gave my mom (she wanted the coconut scent, too) rotted from the tip down its second winter. Now she's pretty good about taking care of them and bringing them in before a freeze, so it's maybe a bit cold sensitive. She's in San Antonio, too, where it's not too cold for long.


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I have mine in a 10 gal. black pot...bought it last year from Island Plumeria. My Kauka only smells when the sun is on it. Waimea I like better...Gina is also a good one for me in a container BUT Barely smells. Just got Roxy from JJ and it is suppose to smell great and flower really well..hope this helps...roxanne


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RE: Good Container Growers

  • Posted by mksmth oklahoma 7a (My Page) on
    Fri, Mar 29, 13 at 10:22

Hey Allan

Maybe Kenny will see this and post his experience with plumeria in OKC. He has a ton of plants and they are do very well here, well there, I'm in Tulsa.

Yes Divine is compact but I wouldnt discount it. I have one and it is a great little plant. Mine even re-bloomed on last year inflo around christmas time. I believe that most of Jungle Jacks plants stay pretty compact.

As our good friend Bill said,"you eventually need land the size of a VW bug for each plant"

they are a tree so having to do regular root and top pruning will be critical for just about type to stay manageable in containers

Miami rose and Aztec gold have been said to be "leggy"

A nursery here had a few Miami Rose that I almost bought solely because they smell like suntan lotion which I like, dont judge me, LoL but didnt because of how tall they get. The ones they had were 6 feet tall and had not branched yet.

Mike

This post was edited by mksmth on Fri, Mar 29, 13 at 17:53


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RE: Good Container Growers

Waimea has a beautiful scent, although I find it hard to describe. It is a very strong grower--wouldn't exactly call it "compact"--but it tends to spread wide and as such it does, IMO, make a good container tree.

Because it grows so strongly, its rootball will fill whatever container you put it in more quickly than you could possibly believe; also then, as you might guess, it's extremely thirsty. I can't seem to water mine enough. But if you can put up with those qualities, then Waimea is one of the very best cultivars you can possibly grow. When it blooms, it's dreamy.

Greg


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RE: Good Container Growers

  • Posted by k2fl okc 7 (My Page) on
    Fri, Mar 29, 13 at 13:49

Allan,

I just saw the post from Mike and realized you're from OKC too! Did you buy your Penang Peach online? I do have quite a few in my collection. They typically do well outside from spring to fall here. In the summer, however, I shield them from the afternoon heat, when it gets past 95F. Generally speaking you can grow most plumerias in containers.

If you don't like tall/leggy growers, I would stay away from the Moragne ones. If you are looking for good bloomers, I heard Thornton Lemon Drop is a good one to have. My favorite one so far is Thornton Mardi Gras, Great colors and a heat lover too.

Jungle Jack has Thai cultivars that are quite compact, which makes them excellent for containers. Divine is definitely a must-have!

There are some plumeria photo galleries you can check out just to get an idea of what the flowers look like. Three that I can think of are Lopaka's, Tropic~7's, and Gulf Coast Plumeria. You can also go to the PSA's site to look up info on growth habits and fragrance.

Kenny

This post was edited by k2fl on Fri, Mar 29, 13 at 13:57


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RE: Good Container Growers

Greetings.

You can't go wrong with Penang Peach -- but even IT will grow big. I 'prune' mine by accidently letting it fall over and small branches break off! but it is getting BIG. However, it is considered a more compact variety. I wouldn't be without it.

Also, like Mike says, do not discount Divine just because of what you hear about it being small. I think from what I can tell, that it will probably be ideal for containers -- and does it like to bloom? Mine has been blooming all winter under lights. And fragrant. I would add to your list.


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Mike, I can't judge you at all. I had read that Miami Rose smelled like suntan lotion and really wanted one. That is why kauka wilder is on my radar, thought i could get a coconut like smell, but a better looking bloom than Mami rose.

Greg, I have no problem with root trimming or pruning. As for the watering, it will be right by my Brugmanisas. So, to say that I will already be doing a bit of watering, is a major understatement. My only concern is that I don't have a greenhouse or a heated garage, so I have to bring them inside. I don't mind keeping a light on them, but i do, at some point, have to fit them through a doorway. I figured that with some larger cultivars that might be too much pruning.


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How about a Dean Conklin? Pink/Orange, big flowers, not leggy, good to fair fragrance and seems to be just fine in high heat.

Dean Conklin in early June of 2012 (cell phone pic).


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Hey Kenny, I knew that Mike was from Oklahoma, but I didn't know there was someone right here in the city! Yes, I got Penang Peach online. I believe it was 1 stop aloha on ebay. I don't have much afternoon shade, so i was going out and pulling it under the porch mid afternoon. However I got where I left it out most of the day and, surprisingly, didn't have any problems. I was giving a little water everyday, though.

Everyone seems to have a pretty high opinion of Divine. It's not that I am discounting Divine, it is certainly on the radar. I just really liked the vivid color of Waimea. Divine does seem to be quite the bloomer, though.


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Hi Allan!

I'm in Tulsa along with Mike.
I wasn't impressed with the scent from Divine so I gave mine away to a friend in OKC. Perhaps I shouldn't have been too hasty but I want a plumie with a strong, noticeable scent.

Anyway throwing in my two cents on some plumies you may consider. Daeng Maha Choke (aka Bangkok Fire) and Gold Coast Peachy. I believe both are supposed to be fairly compact growers and both are supposed to smell great. I just got them last year and they haven't bloomed for me yet but I'm definitely looking forward to the time when they do!

-Robert


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Hey Robert, I was surprised to come across one Oklahoma plumeria grower, but three is just crazy. Nice to know that I'm not alone in dealing with the kind of weather that we get. I'm with you, I like a good strong fragrance. I do like the amount of blooms that Divine seems to put out, though.


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  • Posted by mksmth oklahoma 7a (My Page) on
    Fri, Mar 29, 13 at 21:07

Yep Allan. The Okies are taking over! LoL. There was another lady from Tulsa who posted awhile back about hers but I haven't seen her around lately.

Mike


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Allan,

I'd love to see your garden! I'm obsessed with fragrant plants and grow brugmansia, brunfelsia, jasmines, plumerias, etc. :)

-Robert


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Robert, i'm afraid my garden is quite pitiful compared to some of the amazing gardens I see from the photos on this forum. I have your same obsession with fragrant plants, that is one of the reasons I don't want a lanky plumeria. I'm afraid people would start to look at me funny if I were to start dragging a ladder out there just to have myself a whiff.

I have only started growing tropicals in the past couple of years... with a few setbacks(spider mites). Outside of the Brugmansias and one Plumeria, my only fragrances consist of honeysuckle and butterfly bush. I did buy a passiflora "incense" that I am keeping my fingers crossed for it to come back out.

I am really dreading the spider mite battle that is to come. I could literally go out right now and pull up a common lawn weed covered in spider mites.


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Uploaded with ImageShack.us
Thornton Lemon Drop is one of the best container plumerias because it inflos on almost every branch and then branches. You get a compact plant with masses of flowers (many inflos put out 15-25 flowers at a time). It is hardy and the flowers have a nice scent. Last year this plant (4 years older than picture) had 300-400 flowers at any one time for 4 months.


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Allan, we had an historic infestation of both spider mites and aphids last year in Texas. Covered all our cars in a layer of sticky goo. Good news is this year I'm already seeing lots of lady bugs so I hope they'll keep the aphids down at least.

And I agree with Bill about Thornton Lemon Drop. It does great in a container. Mine has one inflo so far, on a two-inch tip! I'm so used to waiting on two-FOOT tips to bloom, that this is a great surprise. However, TLD is a water-hog, but if you have brugs that should be no problem for you.

Greg, does Waimea do well in less sun than some others? I know a lot of reds don't like too much sun, especially in the afternoon. I'm trying to figure out where I'll need to put mine if it's going to fill up its pot with roots soon!


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Jandey, the funny thing about the ladybugs is that I've bought and released a couple thousand for the past two years and they just don't seem to stick around much. I may try lacewings this year, I've heard that they stay a little closer. I thought about mantids for all around control, but I would figure that a spider mite may be too small for them to mess with.


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I'll add Thornton Lemon Drop to my list.

Has anyone grown makaha sunn?


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  • Posted by k2fl okc 7 (My Page) on
    Sat, Mar 30, 13 at 18:03

Allan,

I have Makaha Sunn as well as Lemon Drop, Waimea, and Kauka Wilder. With the heat we have in OKC, they should bloom true to their colors. Mine haven't bloomed yet so I will let you know when they do!

Kenny


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Jen:

My Waimea is in probably the sunniest spot on the property. It gets on-and-off sun from morning 'til about 1p, after which it is directly in the afternoon blaze. Seems to handle it just fine...I didn't even know the thing about reds and too much sun until very recently, actually...so maybe ignunce is bliss?

G


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Kenny, have you had any trouble with Makaha Sunn taking the sun? I read that it is obtusa and that they don't take the sun as well. I had not seen Makaha Sunn before last night when I happened to come across a photo. I have to say, i like the look of it best, but I'm starting to wonder if I'm going to end up with more than just one.


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  • Posted by k2fl okc 7 (My Page) on
    Sat, Mar 30, 13 at 19:44

Allan,

I don't think Makaha Sunn is an obtusa. From what I heard, MS is cold sensitive and prone to getting black tip. I got mine toward the peak season of summer last year so I haven't grown it for a full season yet. From what I observed, it didn't have any problem being in our OK heat. I got MS for its strong fragrance and its bright orange and red colors. It's one of those highly sought-after plumerias so expect to pay a pretty penny for one.

Kenny


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Kenny, you may very well be right about it not being obtusa. I was just going by DG's website, but it wouldn't be the first inaccuracy that I've come across on that site.

Right now I'm trying to decide between Waimea and Makaha Sunn. I think I'm going to get a Thorton Lemon Drop along with whichever one I choose.

Do you think that it is too early to be thinking about ordering something? Most seem to come from Hawaii, i'm not sure what weather they would go through in shipping.


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  • Posted by k2fl okc 7 (My Page) on
    Sat, Mar 30, 13 at 22:43

Allan,

It's not too early to think about ordering now. I've been receiving plumerias since late Feb. As long as it's not too cold out. Your plants should be ok.

For Thornton Lemon Drop, I think you should get in touch with some nurseries in Texas. You might even find Waimea and Makaha Sunn there. I'm sure our plumie friends living in Texas will chime in and give you some insights.

Kenny


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That Dave's Garden posting about Makaha Sunn being obtusa is a mistake. I have two and they are absolutely not obtusas, but I have also heard that they black-tip and are cold sensitive. My experience is that they don't like the severe sun we get here in Texas; their leaves burn quickly.

Mine are grafted and haven't bloomed yet, but Barbra's has and she says it's an extraordinary flower.


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Oh, and Greg, thanks for the info on Waimea and sun exposure.

Allan, Florida Colors has Lemon Drop.


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Hi!!

I also have Two Makaha Sunn. One was grafted from FC and the other i rooted last year. They have not bloomed for me either. Bud Guillot found this tree at Makaha Beach in Hawaii and named it in honor for the famous surfer "Rell Sunn" Who was related to the person who gifted a cutting to Bud. He honored Rell who passed from Breast Cancer.
She is known as the "Queen of Makaha". Quite the beauty of Makaha..

I cant wait to see this one bloom . The story behind this variety is why i was attracted to this one as well as the stunning color. This is one to have in your collection.

Thornton Lemon Drop is another must have in my opinion.

Ok.. Divine too! I have to stop or i will llist more!!! ;-)

Have fun and welcome to the forum!!

Laura


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don`t water them nearly as much as the brugmansia! The brugs will try to get you to water them daily if not more often, mine look almost dead in the mid-day heat and perk back up when the sun sets. But the plumeria prefer to be on the drier side.

Mardi gras is a fairly fast grower and gets tall quickly. The colors are awesome but not sure about growing it in a pot.

I`ll ask around about Waimea for you, I think Becky over in LaMarque has it and Paula might, she works on the island and will bring plants to me. Makaha Sunn I have not seen locally but then again wasn`t looking for it.
Tally HO!


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Laura, thanks so much for the history lesson. There really seems to be a lot of great stories behind plumeria in general.

A lot of people seem to have a grafted Makaha Sunn that hasn't bloomed. Do grafted plants take longer to bloom?


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Jandey, do you know if what Florida Colors has is a cutting, rooted cutting, or graft?


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  • Posted by mksmth oklahoma 7a (My Page) on
    Sun, Mar 31, 13 at 17:23

Allan.
All of Florida colors rooted plants are grafted. Occasionally they have cuttings available.

Mike


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RE: Good Container Growers

Thanks for the info, Mike.

I have never had a grafted plumeria, so i really don't know the pros and cons. I have had a couple of problems with other types of plants that are grafted, but have no idea about plumeria.


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Allan, if it's listed on their site then it's generally available as a graft. So far, TLD seems very robust, like Celadine but more compact. The scent is medium and a sharper citrus than Celadine, which is sweeter to me. Lemon Drop's flowers are big, too, like 3-1/2 to 4". It's a very pretty flower:
TLD Sept 2012

From what I understand, certain black-tip prone ones like Makaha Sunn are better off grafted since the root-stock will be hardier than their own roots would be. I have seen no sign of black-tip on my MSs, though they are my most spoiled plants, lol!


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Hi Laura, I have a Makaha Sunn and it is one of my prized posessions. After two years of caring and watching over it it finally bloomed last year. I was amazed at the smell, color, number of flowers and its scent. You know me...its all about the scent. This morning I counted eight developing inflos ( two carried over from last year) I will post pictures when they develop more. Fyi...I did lose one Makaha Sunn to black tip. First time ever that happened. As soon as I get the courage to prune it, I will be adding more to my collection. Its that good!


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Thanks a lot, Purdee. Just when I think I have my mind made up, you come in here talking about this wonderful fragrance. :D

I actually think that I should go with Waimea and Thorton Lemon Drop. Maybe I will try Makaha Sunn when I get a little bit more experience under my belt.

I did come across a picture of another one that grabbed my attention called Marjorie, but I can't find much info about it.


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Purdee, out of curiosity, are your Makaha Sunns rooted or grafted?


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Makaha Sunn is AKA Inferno, right? roxanne


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Does anyone know what the habit is like for confetti or marjorie?

These are just two more that i've found to have an amazing bloom.


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  • Posted by k2fl okc 7 (My Page) on
    Tue, Apr 2, 13 at 2:33

Rox,

I think Makaha Sunn and Inferno are similar but no official word on whether they're the same plant. Suki from Tropic Nature used to sell Inferno on her site. There's a seller in FL who owns both and she said they're 2 different plants.

I have 2 Makaha Sunns also but they're both rooted. One is a blooming size plant with 2 new tips I got from Matt last summer. The other one I got earlier last month from a grower in CA. It's a much smaller plant with thinner girth but it has an inflo! When I saw it, my mind just said "what are you waiting for? Buy it!" lol...and that's how I have 2.

Allan,

Feel free to check back with me about how Makaha Sunn does in OK weather. If you haven't bought Waimea yet, I can get you a rooted one. Send me a PM and I'll give you more details on it.

Kenny


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Thanks k2fl...glad to get that straight in my head. Is Suki still at Tropic Nature? I had ordered 5 cuttings from her 3 years ago. 2 of the 5 did not make it...kilawea was 1 of them. I cannot seem to find her sight now....mahalo, roxanne


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  • Posted by k2fl okc 7 (My Page) on
    Tue, Apr 2, 13 at 9:30

Rox,

When I was in Oahu last November, I tried to get a hold of her but had no luck. Her website is not active at the moment. I'm not sure if she's still around. Her phone number is also no longer active. You can try emailing her.

Kenny


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thanks...I tried the e-mail I had...no luck...hope she is okay...roxanne


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I have yet to see it grow but I think the Celadine canopy cuttings from Molokai Plumeria are going to make fabulous container plants.


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Jandey, my Makaha Sunn is rooted.


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  • Posted by mksmth oklahoma 7a (My Page) on
    Tue, Apr 2, 13 at 22:29

allan

confetti is also known as Barbados showgirl. Brads buds and blooms and florida colors sells it as barbados. Exotic plumeria sells it as confetti only about 1000x more expensive. It is quite a nice looking plant.

Mike

This post was edited by mksmth on Tue, Apr 2, 13 at 22:33


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  • Posted by k2fl okc 7 (My Page) on
    Tue, Apr 2, 13 at 22:43

Allan,

Marjorie is a seedling Fuzzy hybridized. He just started selling it at the end of last season. I believe he had sold 3 to date. Since it's not registered with the PSA and only a few have it, you're better off contacting him directly on eBay and inquire about its growing habit.

Mike,

I sent you an email earlier did you get it?


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Kenny,

I actually purchased a Marjorie the other day. I contacted Fuzzy and he said it was a medium grower that is very hardy. I know next to nothing about it, but absolutely loved the flower. It may be a huge mistake, or the best one ever,,, i guess not knowing is part of the fun.

Did you get my e-mail about the info for Waimea? I've never used this site for e-mail, so I hope that it went through.

On a side note, I was thinking about trying the gritty mix, or at least some of it's ingredients. I figured it was worth asking if you've ever attempted to located the ingredients here in the city.


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  • Posted by k2fl okc 7 (My Page) on
    Wed, Apr 3, 13 at 16:10

Allan,

Never a mistake when it comes to plumeria! It might be one of the best bloomers you have. Yes I got your email and replied shortly. I use gritty mix for all of my plumies. You can get chicken grit, marketed under the name Manna Pro, from Tractor Supply in Moore for $10 a bag.

Turface can be bought from John Deere in Norman. Ewing also carries Turface but they are smaller (finer) in size so I always go to John Deere. If you're only making enough for a few plumies, I would suggest going to NAPA and buy the floor dry Oil Absorbent (part number 8822). It's about $8 a bag vs. Turface $20

Now for the last tricky ingredient, you can get fir bark from Petsmart. It's marketed under the brand Zoo Med Repti-bark. I think it's about $20, enough to make the mix for 2 8-inch pots, maybe 3. I have a wood chipper so I get my fir bark from TLC nursery on NW Expressway & Council. They have huge 3 cubic ft bags you can get for under $10. The only caveat is that they don't have "mini" size fir barks. I got the small size barks and I have to run them through the wood chipper to get them small enough for the gritty mix.

Hope this helps. If you have any questions, let me know.

Kenny


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Kenny,

Thanks so much for the info. I can actually walk to the tractor supply from my house. Last year, I had no idea where to find the ingredients. I ended up using metro-mix from K&K and busted a bunch of lava rock with a sledge and added a LOT of perlite. It actually ended up working rather well, surprisingly.

P.S. If you sent me an e-mail regarding Waimea, I didn't get it. I don't know if I had gardenweb settings right.


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I just wanted to take the time to thank everyone for all the help. This forum is easily full of the most helpful people on the entire site, possibly any site. I ended up getting Marjorie on a whim and I am still looking for Thornton Lemon Drop. They have it at Florida Colors, but I am a little hesitant to get a graft and can't seem to find a rooted cutting. Anyways, thanks everyone.

Also, I'm including a photo of the rooted cutting that I received for anyone who may be considering giving Marjorie a try. It really is a thick monster of a cutting.


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and is that an info I see on it? I would root it with the egg method and then no need to cut off the info. All 18 of my new cuttings for this season I have done that with for the 3rd year running and they take right off and bloom as well.....good luck, roxanne


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Roxanne,

I actually ordered this one rooted, so you could not pay me to cut off that inflo. I don't believe that I've heard of the egg method. I'll have to look that up for future references. I look for rooted plants when ever possible, due to a lack of patience. How I got hooked on a hobby that is almost all patience, I do not know. :)


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Emerson has Thorntons lemon drop, I think that is who I got it from last fall, I`ll check the tag. If you don`t find one I can pick one up for you and mail it. He lives 2 blocks from my brother.

Have not found a rooted Waimea yet, I know I saw them last year but can`t remember at whose house.
Tally Ho!


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Makaha Sunn has an amazing coconut scent, FWIW. A few seasons ago I purchased a cutting and it came with an inflo. I decided to leave it on, and it never did root but the smell was fantastic.


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I have read that Makaha Sunn (AKA Inferno) is hard to root. All the ones I have ever purchased with an info on it I have not cut off, however, I do root with the whole raw egg under...they bloom and root at the same time, at least in my area. Success rate is now over 45 for doing it this way. Good luck, roxanne


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Rox, I tried to root a big Makaha Sunn cutting a couple of years ago. I used the raw egg and bottom heat but got nothing after six months.

It pushed up a beautiful inflo but the trunk got alarmingly shriveled, so I sent it to Luc before it could croak on me. He cut it into 4 pieces and the two tip pieces actually took the graft, thank goodness! They've grown beautifully since, but I would never try to root that variety again, egg or no egg.


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yes, someone did tell me it is best to be grafted...maybe it was you? :-) roxanne


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I don't have Makaha Sunn, but I love my Waimea. It is currently potted and a great bloomer.

astrl


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