I now want to persue a career in ornamental horticulture but I am afraid I might have to pay thousands and thousands more to go back to school (I already am paying for my design school until I am 30!)

Also, I feel like a failure somewhat to my parents who really thought I can make it in the industry and one day be the next big thing. To them, making a lot of money is very important. I still do love fashion very much but its too crazy and materialistic. There's too many egos and crazy personalities that I don't want to surround myself with anymore. Plus, not find a job hasn't helped either.

Can anyone help me? I want to move back to California but I don't know where to begin. Any advice would be much appreciated!

The good news is that you can get an entry level job in the field fairly easily without credentials, especially at a garden center this time of year when they are so busy they'll hire just about anyone who breathes.

I took up a third career in horticulture after being a stay-at-home mom for 10 years. I started by working part-time at the local garden center, then after two years switched to being an interior plant maintenance technician, because the work was year-round instead of seasonal. If you're dying to work with plants now, you can probably find a job like mine in NYC before you move, but you won't be outdoors in the wide open spaces.

If you've got a background in fashion, you probably already have a good artistic and design sense, you just need the techical details to translate it into plants instead of fabric. Get a job somewhere in the industry, work hard, make a good impression and network. Or maybe volunteer at a botanic garden somewhere - that can lead to a job and you can see how you like the work. Take some community college classes while you do. Good luck! Feel free to email me if you want to converse more.

By the way, Laag speaks wise words.

Given that you ended up in fashion design when you feel your life calling was horticulture ... at the very least ... like it or not .. get a two year degree in ornamental horticulture or something related. Landscape design ?

Most "good" horticulture jobs require at least that much .. check into industry certifications get as many as you can.

In todays world every career is competative .. nothing is 100 % secure and NOTHING is easy. It is also somewhat common to see people hybridizing educations .. career paths ect.. Innovate ... don't look for money make it !!

Still let's be honest .. if someone graduated as a civil engineer would you hire them to operate on your brain ?? .. or hire a doctor to frame your house ??

Somehow ... and I don't know how ... that's your job ... you need to make that fashion design degree work for you in horticulture ... look around .. it must give you a different perspective into your work in addition you will need to reeducate yourself a bit .. all the while keeping your eyes open and your wheels spinning.

Go sit in the garden ... feel what is really driving you ... if there is one ounce of fear in your decision making it could be really clouding things up. Be still and listen to yourself.

Good Day ...

You know, I feel I would be much happier working in horticulture. My friends say it's a hobby that I want, not a career. However, it goes more far than just a hobby, it's sometimes I really want in my life and something I want to turn a career into.

I know any industry has its down sides and every industry is competitive but the competition in fashion isn't so forgiving and so friendly. It's a very tough industry with people who unfortunatly can make you or break you because of something that you have no control over. Do you know what I mean?

There is another thread about when is the right time to jump in. It might be in the "professional gardener forum" (I think there is a link to the forum at the top of this page).

D be careful. If you read a lot on this forum, you will find that the majority of people posting who do work in garden/landscape design either have a second job or a spouse with a good job.

Competition is very high because anyone and everyone who gets frustrated with their job and likes plants can just jump in (yourself included). Also, clients are far more likely to hire a design/build company than an independent designer because getting it built is the ultimate goal. That leaves you at a disadvantage.

Also, design/build companies are using design to land contracts to build. I can tell you from experience that when a design/build company does the design work, they close the vast majority of contracts to build. That means that it is very wise to charge relatively low rates on design because it is an extremely effective marketing tool to sell landscape jobs. You, on the other hand, will need to make a living on design. That means that you will have to charge more than they do. The consumer is faced with hiring an experienced company that can also build the landscape, or hiring a less experienced individual who can not build it and pay her more for the design. That is what you are up against.

What typically happens is that people start out with the intentions of designing medium to grand landscapes. Then they find that they can get small garden designs if they plant them as well. They take on this work to bring in some kind of income while they wait for the bigger design jobs to come along. Twenty years later, they are still designing and planting little jobs. There is nothing wrong with that, but it is probably where you'll wind up and probably not where you see yourself going.

You have an immediate advantage over Joe Blow having had training and graduated in a design field - the basis is there. However, like any other profession, there are technical aspects of the business that must be learned, either through OTJ training or by additional formal education. You've already received some good suggestions on how to obtain this needed feature.

There is much to be said for entering a profession that is more in the way of a passion rather than *just* a career. It is very satisfying to go to work each day and do something you love and to be able to create things that others, as well as yourself, find meaningful and appealling, but in accepting that philosophy one often gives up some other quality and in this case it is income that tends to be on the losing end of things. If you can accept that your rewards in entering this profession are likely to be something other than monetary and it still appeals, then by all means, go ahead and make the switch.

There are many aspects to the field of horticulture besides just design and some of them are more lucrative than others. But those on the upper end of the income level will require specific training. You can decide how much more time and money you wish to invest before making the leap, but it is certainly advised to investigate exactly what you want to do and where and then talk to those in the field there before making a final decision.

None of these comments are made to discourage you, only to enlighten you that success in this profession is not nearly so easy as it may appear on the surface and as with any other profession, takes dedication, hard work and dealing with the competition that exists in any creative endeavor. Good luck!

Do you have a specific idea of what aspect of "ornamental horticulture" you wish to pursue? Landscape design, greenhouse growing, nursery/garden center management, gardening, etc.?

I mentioned pursuing interiorscaping while you are stuck in NYC. Found a job posting today - here's the link for you if you wish to pursue it. I don't personally know the company but they are an industry leader, win lots of awards, and the top guy writes a great column in the trade magazine I read.

If you do well at a position like this, you could very likely leverage it into an interior landscaping design job for the same company within a few years. This company does some limited outdoor work, too, I believe.

If you're still job-hunting anyway, give it a try. You can always leave if you hate it.

Guccirush,

If you take the time to mull over the questions that I have asked, I believe the answers will be very similar to the ones you have seen above. I think that you would agree that there are more advantages to those who have industry specific education and experience. It also does not hurt to be "networked" with lots of existing ties throughout the industry. Sometimes it is "who you know" that makes the difference just like the green industry.

In the fashion industry you had some of that going for you, but got discouraged. What will make the difference for you in the green industry?

Once you're clear on that, then you may find that you should invest in another degree. BTW, I'll be paying off my student loans just before my 50th birthday. And I'm doing it with an office job based on my formal training while working part time on developing a flower and plant business (still paying off my 1 year experiement in flower farming, too...)

I think all have a lot in common - back-breaking work, low-paying entry jobs (picking up pins from someone's design room floor for minimum wage while they steal your designs), much sucking up and posturing to get your work noticed, the appearance of glamour (hah).

But we are blessed/cursed with an inventiveness that we can't escape, so pick your field. You can cram several into one lifetime, and probably will.

I started out designing clothing in San Francisco, owned a few boutiques after that, then a couple of flower shops. At age 50, the glamour bulls**t got to me, and I just wanted to nurture things, so I got into landscaping.

A decade later, I realize that I'll never make a decent living if I don't strut, posture, promote, put myself out there (again) as The Hot Ticket. And this is really hard work.

I'd say get out of NYC and become a fancy fish in a smaller pond (pick your pond). You can learn horticulture on your own while you use your Fashion Institute credentials, and maybe make the transition later. There aren't many OLD fashion designers (save Betsey Johnson), and burnout is inevitable, but you could have a great decade or two in Dallas, Atlanta, even San Francisco, before you turn your attentions to Mother Earth.

If you start over in horticulture at this juncture, you'll be back at square one, and this business has major burnout, too. Then what? Become a middle-aged fashion designer?

Get out of New York, get yourself a garden, and see where you can go with what you just mastered. Have a fun ride in that fast lane, then go dig in the dirt. You'll be ready for it.

Good luck!

I'm not your mom, but if I was I might tell you this: If you decide to go back to school, Study Business. Get a solid degree in a field that spans many occupations so that whatever you finally decide to do with your life, you have the knowledge to manage a business on your own or for someone else.

One other suggestion (for what it's worth), you say you're still paying off student loans and will be until you're 30? Consider serving your country while you go to college, there's so much to be done now. All three of my daughters have served in the military (as have I for 27 years) and all have gone to college courtesy of the U.S. government.

A little known fact in the civilian sectors is that for an investment of $1200 during your first year of service, you can receive education benefits of up to $84,000.00. You can study the field of your choice with this money, unlike many large corporations that offer education benefits, but only if you study a field within the realm of that particular business.

I'm not a recruiter, just an old veteran who is also a mother and a patriot. I see in you a young woman who loved studying the one thing she really digs, clothing, but your focus changed when the reality of life set in: time to work for a living. You still are not ready to make a decision on what you want to be when you grow up. Give yourself some time to decide, make money, travel the world, learn a trade that is useful on the outside, earn education benefits, and serve your country.

Cheryl