More than likely.
BTW- Larrea t. isn't native to NM, it's crept in from the south just like mesquite. But it sure does smells great when it gets any moisture on it!

Thanks nmgirl. Sorry but I have to disagree with you on creosote and mesquite not being native to NM. While overgrazing has led to populations of both species moving into areas where they were not previously found, they are both Chihuahuan Desert natives. Parts of southern NM are certainly part of that desert. In fact Larrea tridentata and various species of mesquite are so widespread that they are found in all three of North America's warm deserts.

Chihuahua Desert natives yes, northern part of the C.D., no.

I do wonder what the rock and ground squirrels favorite food was before the mesquite proliferated. Or maybe the squirrels have increased with the plant. They sure love it!

Lol, yeah those mesquite pods must be mighty tasty! And sorry to keep disagreeing with you, but Larrea and Prosopis are most certainly native to the northern portions of the Chihuahuan Desert. And yes, populations or isolated individual plants are sometimes found outside of what is normally considered their normal zone of habitation, such as semi-arid areas of central New Mexico that aren't typically considered to be part of the Chihuahuan Desert. This is especially true of desert transition zones.

Cheers,
cd

I would have to agree with cactus dude. You would have to go back many thousands of years to find a time before creosote came to NM.

That population of creosote is well documented, and is indeed thought to be the northeasternmost (and certainly the most cold-hardy) of the species.

Thanks, fabaceae. I didn't realize that population had been documented. It's always interesting to find a plant genus occurring at the furthest limit of it's range.

Also, I've heard reports of specimens of Ferocactus wislizenii found near Socorro. If true, these would have to be the northernmost limit as well.

cd

I know when I was in the army back in the early 80s we would go to white sands NM and there was creosote bushes everywhere........at least where we were.

I live in Los Lunas a short ways south of Isleta Hill (just south of Albuquerque I-25 goes up over the eastern flank of the hill) and have always been intrigued at how that entire massive hill--of volcanic origin--is strikingly covered with creosote bush, yet our Los Lunas volcano (El Cerro), many times larger than Isleta Hill, has hardly any that I know of.

Yeah rdr115, it's certainly a disjunct population, the origins of which I would find hard to believe are due to simple expansion from overgrazing. Creosote seeds are not capable of rapid, long distance dispersal, so that population is probably a relict one from a long long time ago, when the distribution of creosote was quite different from today. In any case, I just love seeing it each time I go that way.

Abq at 7-9" of rain / year is not semi-arid, it's arid.

The 10" number some use is arbitrary, often followed by, "xxx is barely arid". It misses temperatures, humidity, or how different Tucson and Alamogordo at 12" are. Both are arid, just different deserts and different heat / freezes.

This post was edited by quercus_abq on Sun, Feb 8, 15 at 20:46

People should quit minimizing the Isleta Hill population of creosote as disjunct, outlying, etc. It's within its natural range, tho N part...see link.

Marginalizing creosote from Abq ignores many square miles of urbanization and removal of so much natural. Including reports as recent as 1980.

I'm glad to now live where such things are a non-issue, though El Paso is at the edge of other plants' ranges. Travel NE from here and creosote bushes are few, but loads of sand sage, broom daleas, black gramas, dropseeds, etc...familiar?

Disjunct, out of range, etc for creosote? That's Santa Fe, Edgewood, Farmington, Amarillo. Disjunct for Abq = aspens, green ashes, potentillas, etc.

Guess the location of the below photo?

Here is a link that might be useful: Creosote Bush monographs

This post was edited by quercus_abq on Sun, Feb 8, 15 at 20:11

Accidentally posted 2x.

This post was edited by quercus_abq on Sun, Feb 8, 15 at 20:06

The term disjunct becomes appropriate when you see that for many miles south of Isleta you will not find creosote even in apparently identical conditions (same volcanic parent material, same slope and aspect, same elevation, same plant communities otherwise). Remember that this is a plant that normally dominates the desert for miles and miles where it occurs.

But yes, I agree that this population is within the normal range, just at the northern limits, and although I find the rumors of creosote in ABQ formerly somewhat questionable, they may be true. Still, as an example I would call nearly all the populations of giant sequoia in the Sierra Nevada disjunct, even though they all fall within the overall range of the species.

even though this is an old thread, I'm glad to see some activity on this forum. Maybe with the new Houzz mgmt, it will get more traction. Especially happy to see Mr. quercus_abq, whose blog posts I've been following for a while because they are so informative and spot on for my local area.

Lots of creosote where I am (El Paso-Las Cruces). Lots and lots and lots.

Hi to Everyone,

Very interesting post on Creosote. Does anyone know any nursery nearby where I can find any to plant in my ABQ yard that is nearby? Plants of SW had them a few years back, but I have not seen them there recently.

Also, any general tips on how to site them and cultivate them here in ABQ? I have heard somewhat conflicting info on that.

Thanks,

John R. in ABQ

jfr - have you tried Plant World on El Pueblo Rd NE? They have a good selection of native plants. I haven't tried growing creosote so have nothing useful to suggest.

Cheryl

nmfruit - that's amazing, but Santa Fe is milder than people perceive, too. Since miles of creosote N of Socorro died to the roots but came back, even some die-back around Las Cruces, T or C and 'Gordo', you're in good company.