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do i NEED a water feature? (dartfrog topic)

Posted by tropichris maryland zone 7a (My Page) on
Mon, Jun 15, 09 at 20:16

Hello;

I am planning to get some Dendrobates azeureus dartfrogs, and from what i have seen, every vivarium with dartfrogs has a waterfall or small pond. Mine doesnt. I also noticed that the plants in a vivarium do better in a viv. with a water feature (im not sure if this is true.)

for now, all i have in my vivarium is a small water bowl and a small bromelaid. The temerature in the vivarium is around 70-80 oF and humidity is around 75-80%. The light is high enough for the plants. would this vivarium be suitable for these dartfrogs? and, do i need a water feature?

Also, i havent noticed any moss growing in this tank, the soil is coco-peat and is kept fairly moist. from the stats above, could you reccomend any mosses that would work? I have pillow moss from my local woods, I picked it while it was still alive, and it is not growing.

~chris


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: do i NEED a water feature? (dartfrog topic)

Hello Chris,

Do some searches and perusing of posts on this forum. There actually is quite a bit of info if one does the research. But I'll hit your Qs as best I can........

do i need a water feature?

No. Pdfs will not make use of a waterfall or stream or deep pool. In fact, a deep pool could actually be the death of a pdf. Water features are used for 2 reasons:
1) to help keep humidity levels up; and
2) aesthetics

I also noticed that the plants in a vivarium do better in a viv. with a water feature

That can depend in part on the plants in question but basically, no.

The light is high enough for the plants

And you know this based on what? No offense intended but you have one brom (many of which can survive low light conditions) and moss that isn't growing. What size tank do you have and what is your light source?

i havent noticed any moss growing in this tank, the soil is coco-peat and is kept fairly moist. from the stats above, could you reccomend any mosses that would work?

What kind of substrate was your moss growing on in the wild? Not all mosses will grow on peat. How long has your moss been in there. Moss does tend to be slow to get going and growing but you light might also be insufficient or other conditions inadequate. Btw, what kind of water are you using?

Java moss, though I've never tried it, seems to be used alot in the hobby.

I have pillow moss from my local woods, I picked it while it was still alive, and it is not growing

Well too late now but you may have introduced unwanted 'critters' to your tank. Hopefully not.

would this vivarium be suitable for these dartfrogs

At this point I would have to say "No". Such a barren tank will not make for happy pdfs. There's a reason, if you look at pdf set-ups, that they are lushly planted. Pdfs, like most animals, do not like being left so exposed. They need places to 'hide' from you (whom they will very possibly see as a large predator) and from each other (if you have more than one) in order to feel safe and not stress out.


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RE: do i NEED a water feature? (dartfrog topic)

thanks for the info.
How i know the light is enough-
1. the terrarium is right next to an east-facing window.
2. a nepenthes i have in the terrarium is growing like a weed (dont these require fairly high light?)
3. A tillandsia ionantha I have in the terrarium bloomed. 4.gynura aurantiaca is keeping it's purple hairs (as protection from high light)
5. cryptanthus bivattus (i think i spelled it wrong) has pink on it's leaves.
6. the Ludisia discolor's leaves bleached out (i made the mistake of planting it in one of the higher light areas in the viv.)

The lighting is currently one 15watt repti-glo uvb lamp designed for lizards and frogs, and one heat lamp (75 watt) i think is from Exo-terra, but im not sure because i threw the packaging out. but the heatlamp is designed ESPECIALLY for lizards. I may downgrade the heatlamp from a 75 watt to a 50. so, from the way the plants are growing, I'd say the light is enough.

No, so far the animals arent acting sick or anything from the moss. I was thinking java moss, but I couldnt find it anywhere. the soil is COCO-peat, not peat.

FYI, when i said "all i have in my vivarium is a small water bowl and a small bromelaid" I meant pools of water. Not the only things in it were those two things.trust me, this tank isnt barren .I have A LOT more plants than it sounds like, here's a list of some.

parlor palm (neanthe bella)
cryptanthus bivvatus (i spelled bivvatus wrong, i know)
gynura aurantiaca
bromeliad
nepenthes sp.
lucky bamboo (dracnea sanderiana)
philodendron "micans"
tillandsia usinoides (spanishmoss)
tillandsia melanocrater tricolor
tillandsia bulbosa
pillow moss (still green)
phalaenopsis orchid
catteyla orchid
several unidentified tillandsia species
peperomia species

Actually, that was a complete list ;)

the terrarium's dimensions are 24"x18"x18"

With a selfmade background (coco-peat ontop of black silicone ontop of great-stuff foam). i put driftwood (washed, of course) into the background to make a tree efect. many of the tillandsia are mounted on the driftwood, and the brom is growing with it's stolon pinned into the background.

I am using filtered water from my fridge. I was using tap water before, but I switched to filtered. after i switched to filtered, i noticed the plants were growing much better than when i was using the tap. I already do have animals in it, so am probably actually not getting pdfs.

the animals are

1 green anole
1 green tree frog
1 gray tree frog
5 cricket frogs (VERY small)
and 1 miniature toad.

~chris


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RE: do i NEED a water feature? (dartfrog topic)

Chris - your vivarium sounds beautiful. Please post a picture or two, I would love to see it. I bought a viv from someone (a med student who made & sold them - this one was his personal one) who moved out of state so I can't call him though I do have his email address. Along with the vivarium, it had one sole inhabitant - a blue pdf who seems fat & happy. I'd love to add a couple more frogs but not sure if that's advised. I just bought some (fresh) vials of fruit flies for him at Petco. Anyway, it looks like a min jungle with a waterfall in the back and a very small, shallow, rocky pool. He seems to love his environment which is extremely wet. I understand they need the moisture for their skin which would otherwise dry and they would die.

Have you found a good source for moss? I would like to try to grow some in front - it's artificial now and is the only thing that is but I'd rather have real moss which is by the way growing nicely on the back (cork) trimmed to look like wood. Would love to hear from you and how your viv is doing. Forgot to mention, mine is a 30 gal. Oceanic cube.

SARose


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