Merry Christmas and Happy new year!

Craig

For sure Craig.

Yesterday late Fedex delivered a long box to me with two dozen red and white roses sent by some folks I've known for a long time in a private e-mail group formed from the tomato folder at AOL in 1991, believe it or not. LOL

They all knew I was homebound at this time of the year and thought to brighten my day, and that they did with great generosity.

I was up in the middle of the night last night, for another reason, ahem, and took some time to try and find an appropriate "Holiday Season" card that I could send as an e-card thanks, and then thought to myself, why am I doing this? Well, I was doing it b'c some of the members are Jewish, and one is black, but celebrates Christmas, not Kwanzaa and so I decided to think it over today. And I have.

I'll send a Christmas e-card b/c that's who and what I am, even though I often bill myself as a born again Druid. LOL

The member who is black sends both Hannukah and Christmas e-cards to all members of the group, but I think I'll break with her precedent and knowing the individual members very well by now, after almost 15 years, I'm sure they won't be offended.

Carolyn

On the other hand, I cannot see why anyone who truly believes in Christmas from a singular sectarian perspective would be offended if he or she received a greeting card with "Happy Holidays," "Yuletide Greetings" or whatever printed on it.

All this media hype recently is just talkin' heads using an issue to promote their TV shows. Video junk mail.

Life is too short for all this manufactured controversy and the anxiety it causes in the lives of otherwise happy, loving, sharing people.

Felis Navidad y Prospero Ano, Bill

I actually have become sensitized to the issue to such a degree that when my wife hands me a card that says something like, "Seasons greetings" I become mildly offended ;-)

On the other hand I have actually tried to be a little offensive (another word for humorous) this year just to see what would happen. While my DW was addressing envelopes I would sign the cards with mostly "Merry Christmas with love" but occasionally I would add one of the following:

1. Elvis loves you and so do we.
2. Merry Christmas and a Quazy Qwanza too!
3. May small festive rodents infest you home. (this one had singing rodents on the cover of the card).

My wife got pissed and put those in a special pile. She didn't want people to think that she wrote that stuff. So they went to closer family members that would know better :-)

Greg

Everyone I know and care enough about to get a card, celebrates Christmas in one way or another, so getting a Christmas card from me shouldn't offend anyone.

Much of today was spent making Christmas greeting calls (via phone) and I had many very nice visits.

Merry Christmas...or Whatever you Celebrate!

Sue

Oy what about the Pagans!

(Being politically correct just in case any pagans get upset at being left out.)
After all they were possibly celebrating first.
This is supposition because I don't seem to have any pagans in my circle of friends. None that I know of anyway.

"Saturnalia's relation to Christmas

It has been postulated that Christians in the fourth century assigned December 25th (the Winter Solstice on the Julian calendar) as Christ's birthday (and thus Christmas) because pagans already observed this day as a holiday. This would sidestep the problem of eliminating an already popular holiday while Christianizing the population. This is supposition however and it is also possible that the early Christians sought to replace the Pagan celebration in an act of triumphalism.
The customary greeting for the occasion is a "Io, Saturnalia!" — io (pronounced "yo") being a Latin interjection related to "ho" (as in "Ho, praise to Saturn")."
[edit]Wikipedia
If we go out of our way to avoid offending those who thrive on being offended we will never please anyone.
Glenn

Hedwarr, I have the same dilemma. When I visit a synagogue I am expected to put a yarmulke on, but when a yarmulke-wearing person visits a church he does not take his off. I send a lot of cards because of my work, which is Christian based, so I sent about 250 Christmas cards this year, and about a dozen Hanukkah cards to friends of the school who are Jewish. One of whom sent me a very nice Christmas gift and card! I always liked the scene in the movie Gandhi where he tells the Muslim family to raise the Hindu orphan as a Hindu, and the Hindu family to raise the Muslim orphan as a Muslim. Joe

Amen, Its like that South Park episode where the Christmas play turns into to a minimalist production by Philip Glass where all the kids are dressed as blobs.

I have had fellow Catholics get upset at the idea of Saturnalia being one of the many many traditions that have been attached to Christmas. Some are so upset by it that they say we should celebrate the birth of Jesus on another day. What I say to them is, "What is the common thread that links all of these old pagan tradions together and keeps them alive long after they should have been lost to the dust bin of history????"

Of course the answer is the birth of Jesus. Many years from now (thousands perhaps) when folks don't tell their kids about St. Nick or don't buy Christmas trees they will still celebrate the birth of Jesus and there will be a whole new set of non-christian traditions attached to Christmas that folks will point to and say, "see! see!" ;-)

But in the end the birth of Jesus will remain as the one common thread that pulls all the others together.

Greg

Mr. Hankey, the Christmas Poo. :)

I figure that whenever someone bothers to give me some sort of present or send me some sort of greeting, the intent was good and it doesn't need to be analyzed. Most folks just try and do the best they can.

I think that a lot of people are missing the fact that hedwarr is discussing her mother-in-law, not just an acquaintance. I also think that this hedwarr email seems to be more about marital power dynamics not just religion.

I think that using the gold paper was a safe compromise. However, sooner or later hedwarr's mother in law is going to have to accept that her daughter in law is Christian. I am sure that hedwarr's husband isn't going to tell his mom to wrap presents in gold paper not hanukkah paper. DH is going to have to realize and behave like his wife comes first.

Hedwarr, after the holidays you might want to have a conversation with your MIL about your faith. If she gets upset, oh well, you are not married to her. Your husband's behavior towards you after this conversation with you MIL, will be a testament (no pun intended) to your marriage.

My husband and I had a similar situation. His family is Catholic and mine is protestant. When my husband's niece was about 4 months old, my BIL and girlfriend decided to baptise her. I told my husband that I was not going to go. Ended up going because, due to his work and school schedule, DH was not able to drive until 11pm to his mom's house which is four hours away. I didn't want him to get into an accident on the way there. After the event, my MIL asked me who was going to be my kids (I don't have any yet) god parents. I explained that I did not believe in child baptizism. This discussion was pretty intense. This is very ironic, because since DH and I have been together (9 years), DH has never gone to church (except for funerals and weddings). I basically, told my MIL that she already had her own children, and I will raise mine however I see fit...I know these kind of conversations are harsh and don't make relationships better...Unfortunately, somethimes, a person needs to stand their ground.

Because I am half Native American, I feel very uncomfortable going to churches at Catholic missions. I first felt this strange nauseous feeling when I was in about 3rd grade. The statues of "indians" bowing down to father J. Sierra don't help the knots in my stomach either.

At the event, I swallowed my pride enough to take pictures. Remember, my only purpose for attending (actually driving to Salinas only) was to make sure that my husband made it his mother's home safe. Would my in-laws have recipricated the kindness I showed by taking pictures, definitely not.

I am very religion tolerant. In my family, there are Catholics, Mormons, Jehovah witnesses, protestants, atheists, anti-Christian Native American religion "revivalist"/scholars and the list goes on. In fact and ironicaally, I grew up with a mother who is atheist and grandparents that are fundamentalist...Go figure. Even more ironic, my mother became a catholic just 5 years ago. Her and my stepfather were remarried in the Catholic church about 3 years ago...That was a total shocker!

The cool thing about having (had) an atheist mother is the complete indifference (i.e. tolerance) of religion. Mom really did not care what other people did. When I was a child I had baby sitters that were fundamentalist Christians and another that was fundamentalist muslim from Pakistan. The muslim family taught me their alphabet (Urdu, sorry I don't remember how to spell it). They also taught me about the Pakistani art (needle work, rugs, henna body dyes, beautiful coloful clothing), Koran and food. Unfortunately, they were not very tolerant (ANGRY) when I asked them questions about Jesus...I didn't know much better 'cause I was in 3-4th grade when they watched me.

When I was in college, I worked for a Catholic community services non-profit for about a year. They only goal was to help the community (youth outreach, food for homeless, and elderly). One of the coolest people that I ever met was father Larry. We spoke a lot about the church and religon. We both respected each other's faith. I would go to off-site church events (camping, hikes, etc), but would not participate in the prayer events. This was always okay with the group.

What offends, disturbs and enrages me is the "convert/revert or die" message some groups send.