I think the reason you don't see as much about hybrids is that many of us like to be able to save the seeds of what we grow and with hybrids you don't get a plant that is true.

There are fantastic hybrids out there and they taste every bit as good so go for it and love planting, growing and eating them!

hiya- i was wondering why hardly anyone planted hybrids -all i see are heirlooms. here in s. ks we need all the letters we can get (vfnt etc,etc) just curious, maybe the non hybrids taste better?? maybe this is a forum for non hybrids!! i sure did not know there was so many toms out there.

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No, not a message site at all just for heirlooms and if you do a search here you'll find plenty of threads about hybrids.

One issue is what you posted above as to having all the letters you can get in Kansas but the various VFNT letters, the most commone ones, are directed only against soil borne diseases and don't confer resistance, rather tolera
ance.

Kansas is not a hotbed of soilborne diseases.

The most common tomato diseases world wide are the common foliage diseases, the two fungal ones, Early Blight and Septoria Leaf Spot and the two bacterial ones, Bacterial Speck and Spot.

Do OP heirloom varities taste better than hybrid ones? Yes in my experience of growing over 3,000 varieties, some hybrids but mostly OP's and most, but not all of them do. Same with the hybrids, do most of them have great taste, no IMO, some do and some don't.

When it comes to yields there are some heirloom varieties that yield just as much as F1 hybrids, and there are some hybrids that don't yield as much.

As for me there are just a few hybrids that I will grow:

Sungold F1
Ramapo F1, altho the OP version is just as good IMO
Supersonic F1
Jet Star F1

Yes, those are all older varieties, meaning the last three, but the earliest bred ones IMO have the best tastes,

And nothing wrong with either Big Boy F1 and Better Boy, F1, both of which have a same parent called Teddy Jones, a large pink heirloom from the midwest.

Just different strokes for different folks and the more varieties anyone grows the better they can compare what they have grown in the past with a new variety to be grown,

Hope that helps,

Carolyn

i was wondering why hardly anyone planted hybrids -all i see are heirlooms.

Do you mean here? Nope, lots of hybrid growers here and many who grow many varieties of both hybrids and open pollinated (aka 'heirloom').

Are there more open-pollinated varieties than hybrids? Yes, hundreds if not thousands more so yes they often get more discussion.

Can you grow open-pollinated varieties in Kansas? Yes, many do. Have you ever tried any of them?

Do they taste better? Many do and that's why they were used to create hybrids. Look at all the common hybrids. Were they developed to improve flavor? No, for marketing, shipping tolerance, increased production and for disease resistance.

But over all the flavor all depends on the variety and the growing conditions.

Dave

Nice post, Carolyn.

You left out Moreton F1, though, which is one you
recommended to me and which I am growing again this year.

Yes, right alongside my Dona F1.

NJAES takes a few weeks to fill seed orders but Harris has
them right in the catalog and even a bit lower price.

Understanding what diseases are common to your area will help you in choosing appropriate varieties if you choose to use that basis for determining what to plant. I both agree and disagree with the statements made. You can get excellent flavor with selected hybrid varieties..some new high sugar varieties have no heirloom counterpart that can compare to that single sweetness trait. Although there are a few noted heirloom varieties with minimal Late Blight resistance, if you want to weather a storm when all your neighbors have suffered complete loss due to that one disease you need to either be growing a resistant variety or have been on a very short interval well planned spray program.
Note that I use the term "Resistance" as most of the scientific community. I herd experts interchange the words "Resistance" and "Tolerance" multiple times in the same presentation. I don't distinguish a real difference. In the end its the harvest that counts.

So what do I look for in selecting hybrid varieties. I consider just about every trait anyone might look for: Aside from taste, yield and appearance there are definite qualities that make any variety stand out: Resistance to foliar diseases like leaf mold,early blight, late blight, tomato spotted wilt virus, bacterial speck and bacterial spot are a few that you likely have experienced in KS. I would also look for varieties that continue producing despite lower or higher than optimal temps. As a market seller I highly consider the potential of high percentage marketable fruit.

Despite my leading statements I am not speaking out against heirloom varieties. I will be growing over 200 heirloom varieties this year, up almost 20 from last year. I like most of them for their attributes but were it not for my customer demand (even for those ugly cracked rejects) I would prefer to grow just hybrid varieties.

Yes Sneezer, I usually list the three Harris bred hybrid varieties Supersonic, Jet Star and Moreton Hybrid, but I was in a hurry and forgot the Moreton one.

Now that myseed offer elsewhere is taken care of I have to send out seed for trial to severa tomato seed sites, still deal with some SSE requests coming in and ASAP copy down all the new ones sent to me to let the 4 folks who do seed production for me know what they are and that's kinda what was on me wee tomato brain cells. LOL

Carolyn

thanks for the info i will try some op's i also will be planting sungold.

A few Sun Gold plants are a good choice but SunSugar has better forgiveness (less cracking) with all other characteristics pretty much even. SunPeach is a new pink cherry that is supposed to be just as sweet as Sun Gold but with leaf mold resistance and less cracking also. Then who can resist Jasper, a new AAS selections winner that was claimed by Johnny's to be the sweetest tasting cherry tomato and it has Late Blight resistance among others.
A plant buyer called me recently to place an order for tomato plants; he usually has purchased heirloom plants showing favor to bicolor heirlooms. To my surprise he requested 100 Jasper plants and also some Favorita plants. I had only ordered 100 seeds of Jasper initially so I needed to place another order and although I'm totally impressed with Favorita I didn't order more due to the price. His order gave me reason to renew growing one of my favorites. My followup order has been shipped and I can hardly wait to get them growing.

Hi Treeshaker, from Glenn in Wichita. Over the years I've found that toms, both heirloom and hybrids, will flourish here, and I grow both. Heirlooms for the taste, hybrids for the excellent production. All will vastly outperform any storebought tomato in taste. Personally I'm a black tomato nut so that's what I concentrate on. Some toms I start from seed but in the past few years the home improv stores here have exploded in their selection of seedlings, both types. Good luck!

Bmoser is calling Johnny's..."Please press your 7 digit customer # located on the back of your catalog"

How's it going Timmy? Should mention that Rebelski is still on the list for this year- already growing nicely. I will add that Johnny's has been good to me. Both orders I placed this year were promptly filled and thus far I've received 3 catelogs. They don't get my biggest seed order but I will admit I'm impressed with their selection.

"Bubblewrap Bill"

I grow both.

I also grow both heirloom and hybrids. I don't choose them based on their status as heirloom or hybrid, but instead other's recommendations or my own experience tasting them. And sometimes just plain curiousity.