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Early blight?!?!?

Posted by BarleyBean15 6A (My Page) on
Fri, Aug 15, 14 at 0:58

Is this early blight or something else?


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Early blight?!?!?

Whatever it is, remove the diseased branches and spray a fungicide - preferably organic.

And next year, I suggest you to mulch the soil.

I hope you water your tomato plants at the base, not from the top.


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

I can see only one good lesion and can see the ring structures inside that leasion, so yes, Early Blight, which can occur early or late in the season.

I can't see the whole plant but if the affected leaves are near the top of the plant it means that the spores for EB were transmitted via wind or embedded in rain drops.

What about your other tomato plants as to EB or is it just this one, which could change the situation a lot.

If thelower leaves, then yes, it came from what's called splashback reinfection from spores dropped by infected plants in a previous year. If so, then mulching might help.

As was said above, remove and dispose of of all infected foliage.

But unlike Daniel, I suggest you spray with Daconil, which is synthetic but has less toxicity than Rotenone, organic, which is accepted by all organic certifying agencies I know of.

Not all organic products are good and not all synthetic products are bad.

Your choice as to what you want to do.

Carolyn, who wishes that ALL discussions of organic and non=organic products would be discussed in the Forum here devoted to that, I can't remember the name. I only post in this Forum although I used to post in quite a few here in years gone by.


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

Agree with Carolyn, The organic forum is a good place to discuss organic versus non-organic. There is also one dedicated to heirlooms for those who dislike hybrids and vow to never plant them again.

As for the yellow tomato leaves of the OP, lack of water or nitrogen are the most likely causes.

Here is a link that might be useful: Link to organic


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

BarleyBean15, when I wrote ORGANIC fungicide, I was thinking of Copper (Bonide) or Actinovate. I didn’t say ANYTHING about Rotenone !!!

Daconil, is a CHEMICAL fungicide, and I will NEVER use it ! Powerful but potential dangerous.

This post was edited by Daniel_NY on Fri, Aug 15, 14 at 14:16


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

  • Posted by digdirt 6b-7a North AR (My Page) on
    Fri, Aug 15, 14 at 14:40

Point is Daniel it should be "fungicide of choice".

When you say "preferably organic" that implies things that may or may not be true such as they will work better.

Rather it is your personal preference to use only an 'organic' fungicides and it really should be worded as such.

There are any number of fungicides available, both synthetic and organic (which can also be chemicals) and each gardener can make their own choice.

Dave


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

BarleyBean, No matter which route you take, organic or not, I'd go ahead and pull off those ripening ones now before you spray. That being said, like Carolyn and Dave I use Daconil. My biggest complaint with it is if you buy the ready-to-use, their spray bottles aren't so great. I pour it into something that mists finer - and stand upwind while spraying. And a good SHARP pair of pruners helps also.
Good luck!
Edie


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

Dave wrote: > Point is Daniel it should be "fungicide of choice".

Yes, you're right.

Dave wrote: > Rather it is your personal preference to use only an 'organic' fungicides and it really should be worded as such.

Well, English is not my first language, so deep semantics, still have secrets for me.

Dave wrote: > When you say "preferably organic" that implies things that may or may not be true such as they will work better.

You’re right, instead of PREFERABLY, I should write I PREFER.

I see people here using Daconil. I’m wondering if they know facts about Daconil such as:

- “On September 4, 1987, the [U.S. Environmental Protection] Agency classified chlorothalonil [Daconil] as a Group B2 or probable human carcinogen” [EPA] or

- “[Daconil (Chlorothalonil)]… Link to information on toxicity to humans, including carcinogenicity, reproductive and developmental toxicity, neurotoxicity, and acute toxicity” [Pesticide Action Network] :or

- “In laboratory tests, chlorothalonil causes kidney damage, mild anemia, liver damage, embryo loss during pregnancy, oxidative DNA damage (damage to the cell’s genetic material), and cancers of the kidney and forestomach. Most of these effects have been observed in several test species.” [Northwest Coalition for Alternatives to Pesticides (NCAP)]

I don’t know about you guys, but the above statements, for ME, are enough reasons NOT to use Daconil. Like I said in the past, I'm VERY happy with the organic Copper Fungicide (Bonide), so... I agree that Daconil can fight Late Blight - while Copper might not - but I prefer to surrender to Late Blight when I think about Daconil’s potential dangers. I’m wondering if people here who use Daconil, grow tomatoes for their use or for selling ?

Dave wrote: > There are any number of fungicides available, both synthetic and organic (which can also be chemicals) and each gardener can make their own choice.

As I said in another Early Blight thread, people can use a "fungicide of choice".- organic or synthetic - but it's always good to take INFORMED decisions.

This post was edited by Daniel_NY on Fri, Aug 15, 14 at 18:37


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

Copper fungicide is toxic to environment... in the long run "organic" just as limiting and is not the answer although undoubtely better than chemical way of bombarding plant with pesticides and fungicides.


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

Carolyn- is was on all tomato plants in both raised beds. Mostly on bottom to middle of plants. Both beds were made new this year. I have been watering with a sprinkler so splash up is a problem.
Yesterday I removed ALL leaves, stems, EVERYTHING that looks infected.
My poor tomatoes will surely go into shock!

I would like to use the most organic method to treat and prevent.
That being said any tips on how to both treat and prevent???

Also, my basil plants had similar markings but a member told me basil can not get blight? Thoughts?

D brown thanks for the link.


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

Early Blight Control:

1. Use only clean seed saved from disease-free plants.
2. Remove and destroy crop residue at the end of the season. Where this is not practical, plow residue into the soil to promote breakdown by soil microorganisms and to physically remove the spore source from the soil surface.
3. Practice crop rotation to non-susceptible crops (3 years). Be sure to control volunteers and susceptible weeds.
4. Promote good air circulation by proper spacing of plants.
5. Orient rows in the direction of prevailing winds, avoid shaded areas, and avoid wind barriers.
6. Irrigate early in the day to promote rapid drying of foliage.
7. Healthy plants with adequate nutrition are less susceptible to the disease.
8. Minimize plant injury and the spread of spores by controlling insect feeding.
9. Hand picking diseased foliage may slow the rate of disease spread but should not be relied on for control. Do not work in a wet garden.
10. Use resistant or tolerant varieties.
11. The preventative fungicide chlorothalonil (Bravo) used on a seven to ten day schedule gives effective control.

Source: Early Blight of Tomato (UMaine Extension).

Also read: Ten Tips For Preventing Early Tomato Blight: A Disease (The Rusted Garden)

Soil Splash and Tomato Disease Prevention: Spreading Spores! (You Tube video)

Early Blight videos in You Tube

Early blight search results in GardenWeb forum


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

to the point number two turn in soil over destroys the very soil web we are hoping will kick in and digest that diseased plant
another point we are saying to minimize plant injury and next thing suggest cutting off diseased leaves.... seems like inconsistencies to me...


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

I’m still curious if people here - Dave, Carolyn, Edie…- who use the synthetic fungicide Daconil, grow tomatoes for their use and / or for selling at the market ?


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

Daniel, I raised all my own plants and set out 3 to 400 plants each year,primarily for seed production for my SSE listings and seed offers here and elsewhere.

I also sold some fruits and plants at a large Nursery owned by good friends for several years and also traded fruits for wine/food at several restaurents as well.

But that was many years ago.

Everything changed when I developed hip problems and had to quit teaching and resign and move to where I am now,about an hour north of Albany a few miles from the VT border.

But then on Dec 12th, 2004 I fell exiting a HS play and since then have been in a walker, I severed all four quads in my right leg, and unable to grow what I used to. I have someone else who does what growing needs to be done here, as well as maintaining my perennial beds,my first love, and she grows between 10-20 plants fo r me here at home, for fresh eating for me as well as ones to give away.

She uses Daconil here only in certain years when the fungal spores arrive,

I'm 75 now, raised on a farm where we had many acres of tomatoes so have been up close and personal with them since I was about 5 when I was allowed to sit on the seat that's on the water tank of the then plant setter..

I have researched Daconil extesively, and I mean extensively, and have many links from many places and was going to make some comments about the links you put up,to correct someof them.

But what I've found is that folks who are anti Daconil will remain so, despite info being given to them and those who approve of it will remain so, so I try not to get into discussions about that issue which extends to the proverbial organic vs synthetic issue.

Daconil is not internalized to the plant, what it does is to cover the specific attachement sites on the upper leaf surface for both Early Blight and Septoria Leaf Spot.

So, again, Daconil does not enter the leaf surface nor the stems, thus none to developing fruits.

Most of the time my plants were grown organically, if you will, but sometimes I had obligations otherwise and would use it so I could meet those obligations.

As long as folks are fully aware of the pros and cons of ANY product, which often they are not, then it's their decision to use what works best for them.

Finally, I do a VERY large seed offer elsewhere, and for many years now have had four wonderful folks,two in NC,one in IL and one in WNYS who do all the seed production for me. My job is to find varieties new to all or most and I started doing that after I fell. And in finding those varieties I've made some wonderful friends in Germany, Romania, Slovenia, France, Moldova, Ukraine, Belarus,etc, as well as from many Canadian and US folks.

This past Spring I had to ask for additional volunteers since my regular seed producers couldn't handle the volume. They grow their own tomatoes as well and three of them also list varieties in the SSE YEarbooks, and this is the last year I'm doing that and they are going to list under their own names what they grew for me.

My plants here at home are grown for me by a local young man whom I've been mentoring and giving him a heads up locally by providing him with seeds for all the new varieties I am sent.

I hope the above answers your question directed at me.

Carolyn, who now has to sort the tomatoes in the three boxes that were sent to her and decide which ones she keeps and which ones she gives to the three local friends who expressed interest. One won't take the huge striped one,I know already.LOL Then it's the mens and womens tennis final in Cinci, OH for the afternoon. ( smile)


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

  • Posted by digdirt 6b-7a North AR (My Page) on
    Sun, Aug 17, 14 at 10:59

I see people here using Daconil. I’m wondering if they know facts about Daconil.... I’m still curious if people here - Dave, Carolyn, Edie…- who use the synthetic fungicide Daconil, grow tomatoes for their use and / or for selling at the market ?

Yes I do and and I am primarily an organic gardener though I do not sell as "organic".

But like Carolyn I have researched it extensively, as have many others. Despite your belief, most of us are capable of making well informed decisions. Most of us are also capable of reading label warnings and following instructions..

But the well-informed user seeks out sources that actually present research-based facts. Sources that do not have a skewed perspective due to their personal agendas are available. The sites you linked are well noted, even within the organic community, for that skewed perspective as their names alone indicate.

The choice of what to use is yours but the choice is also mine to make. So if one wants to preach organics there is a forum for it. This isn't it.

Dave


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

You should check out the Weed Forum...someone asks for an ID and how to get rid of it, and then the wingnuts chime in about how those weeds are edible and if they should spray, they'll grow two heads. The only advice they give is: have good soil and then the weeds won't take over - which is neither here nor there as far as solving the original problem. I rarely spray anything either, but I like having the choice should I need it.


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

Donna, ha ha I am one of those too, when people drag their weeds to the curbside I drag them right back as mulch to my garden LOL
I drool at the site of Lamb´s quarters...
Am finding Daniel comments deliberately provocative and not useful for conversation. To the date growing ¨organic¨ only means that one will be using things that made out of natural ingredients. Am thinking it is just as politically defined as everything else. It does not respond to care of producing nutrient rich produce with sustainable practices. So subbing one fungicide for another is not the answer.
One needs to answer how to grow healthy plants that can turn their defense system so good that all those fungal bacterial problems is just a nuisance and not major defoliating beast.
and to the OP- no two gardens alike so what strategies one uses might not be the thing for another. Point is- currently fungal and bacterial problems are the most common ones for newbie as well as very experienced gardener.
This year I have used a number of products and made my conclusions for my current problems. So far am really liking Aerated Compost tea and Actinovate, also use Effective microorganisms with foliar feeds of kelp and fish hydrolysate.
So yeah, advise is the same- it all starts with soil- healthy soil produces healthy plants...


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

I sell my Daconil infested tomatoes at the market some Saturdays. MG infested as well. Sold 2 bushel yesterday. Shall I expect a visit from the Organic Police? Do they have vays of makink me talk?

I also sold some onions, peppers , and cukes. I do it more for the comraderie than anything. I know a lot of folks over there, small town and all.


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

I simply wanted to know if those who sell tomatoes treated with Daconil, eat those tomatoes too…


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

Well yes, we eat them , canned and fresh. I actually only used Dacinol once this year, very early in the season.

Never had a chance later due to all the rain. My plants now look like a war zone, all brown and barren, almost spent. Still picking 25-30 a day though. Slowing down a little. Temp got down to 46 Friday night, the beginning of the end.


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

  • Posted by digdirt 6b-7a North AR (My Page) on
    Sun, Aug 17, 14 at 18:56

Yes we do eat them. We also can and freeze them as do many, many others. But then we also wash our produce before eating it or selling it. So there is no Daconil that gets eaten by anyone unless they want to drink it out of the bottle for some reason.

Dave


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

Well, we simply have different opinions. That’s why this forum is for: to exchange opinions. I think it’s good for less knowledgeable people to know their options.

Personally, like I said a few times, I use the Copper organic fungicide. And I'm happy with the results. But, obviously, I respect others' decisions to use ANY fungicide they desire.

I agree that Pesticide Action Network and Northwest Coalition for Alternatives to Pesticides might have their own agenda - I don’t know how many lies are in their statements - but I TRUST EPA (Coppers Facts) when they say:

> “There are no human health risks of concern for dietary (food and drinking water) exposures to the pesticidal uses of copper.

Current available literature and studies do not indicate any systemic toxicity associated with dietary exposures to copper.”

To wrap up things I would like to apologize if I offended anyone - if I did, it was unintentionally.


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

Copper is needed by plants, some researches think this is why it actually works that is fixes copper deficiency in the plant and helps recovery. However in repeated multiple applications copper fungicide is toxic to environment. As any metals it can build up in the soil. Excessive use will lead to water run off and poisoning living things in that water. Thus most recommendations are given to use sparingly and combine varied methods when needed

Here is a link that might be useful: early bight


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

Daniel - oh heck yeah, I eat my tomatoes. What else would be the point of growing them?!? No, I don't sell them, I don't grow enough to make that worthwhile. I do can or freeze what we can't eat, also. So we consume them pretty much all year long. Some things I draw the line at using - the last time I caught my husband putting out Sevin dust was several years ago and he hasn't dared do so again! So yes, I researched well before I started using the Daconil. For myself, the benefits far outweigh the cons. That doesn't mean that I would force anyone else to my point of view. All I can do when someone asks is tell them what I use and how it has worked for me personally. There are many products and many schools of thought.
Edie


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

Linda, nice link, tx.

So you think it's ok for me to spray Copper this week, Actinovate next week, Serenade the next next week, and repeat ? Shouldn't I HAVE TO stick with one product ?

>... when needed

I though I should spray fungicide PREVENTIVELY from day one and weekly - or at least on a regular basis - and not when the disease hits the plant.

This post was edited by Daniel_NY on Mon, Aug 18, 14 at 10:54


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

Edie wrote:

Daniel - oh heck yeah, I eat my tomatoes. What else would be the point of growing them?!?

Well, you could grow tomatoes for your use. You could grow to sell tomatoes. You could grow to sell and for your use too. You could use the VERY powerful Daconil for the tomatoes you sell and Copper - or other organic fungicide - for the tomatoes that you eat. You use Daconil to be SURE that your crop for the market will not be affected by diseases. Daconil CAN do that, Copper is NOT that powerful.

Edie, I'm afraid you didn't read carefully my comment, which was: "I simply wanted to know if those WHO SELL tomatoes treated with Daconil, eat those tomatoes too…" You wrote that you DO NOT sell tomatoes, so... Obviously, if you grow tomatoes and don't sell them you will... eat those tomatoes. OBVIOUSLY !

Some things I draw the line at using - the last time I caught my husband putting out Sevin dust was several years ago and he hasn't dared do so again!

What was wrong with the SYNTHETIC Sevin ? Are you using now the ORGANIC OMRI-listed Garden Dust (Safer) ?

So yes, I researched well before I started using the Daconil. For myself, the benefits far outweigh the cons.

Ok, I can respect that.

There are many products and many schools of thought.

Yep, and everybody has to live in harmony respecting other people's opinions.

This post was edited by Daniel_NY on Mon, Aug 18, 14 at 12:34


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

What was/is wrong with Sevin for me is that it's a broad-spectrum killer that doesn't differentiate between bad & beneficial. It kills bees :( and the poor little things have enough going against them I don't need to add to it. Yes, I use bT or Neem Oil, but only when necessary, and I wait until just about dark before I spray Neem so that the bees have already gone to bed for the night and really I do try to only use either of them on plants that the bees are not so inclined to be visiting, anyway (I don't spray my squash or cucumber plants with anything, the bT goes on the cabbage and the Neem on pole bean leaves.) Oh, and even if I do get to live out my dream when I retire from the desk job and get to garden extensively enough to set up a booth at a Farmers Market I would still use Daconil. I trust it that much. Of course, I would carefully wash everything before I sell it, I do that for the stuff I give my friends and coworkers, anyway.
Sorry I misread your other post.
Edie


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

Daniel, I am just a student of gardens, so I have no clear answers what is better for each indivisual case. It seems work better for me to use variety and apply as preventative and they keep more often or depending on the weather/time/situation.
I would wait at least 48 hrs between applications and if I applied lets say copper I would go next with something fungal etc


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

Daniel, congratulations for having been polite and diplomatic.

I would never get involved into any topic involving the use of chemicals because I'm such a big treehugger that I'd get angry and couldn't help offending everyone ;-)

Old hippies who've been hitchhicking around the world in their young years have seen that polution ignores human borders.

So yes, every one uses what one chooses too. But as an organic fundamentalist I can't help thinking about all the chemicals moving from here to there in the atmosphere and the oceans. And those paying the bill are not always those who have consumed the stuff.

So yes as a granola I'll stick with the organic forum.


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

I think we can always express our opinions and respect others too.
As mentioned before, simply being "organic" does not mean safe to humans and the environment. For example petroleum products are organic among others.
Then, where does the "organic" material come from ? There was a time that there were no living organisms on the face of Earth. So the source and origin of "Organic" mater is "inorganic matter".

There are also naturally occurring "inorganic" matter vs synthesized by us, humans. Not all "naturally occurring" matter is safe and not all synthesized ones are unsafe. Most of medicine are synthesized without which some of us would have been dead some time ago.

In my opinion, speaking against "man - synthesized/ manufactured" things is knocking our own intelligence and scientific achievements. We owe it to our bigger brain.

On The Topic:

I just sprayed all my tomatoes, peppers, cukes .. with Daconil yesterday. In my mind, I am neither worried about its ill effects on me and my family, nor I feel guilty about harming the environment by using it. I also have NEEM OIL spray and use it to. I feel the same way about using synthetic fertilizers as I use them along with all kinds of manures and organic matter.

Organic Purists:
I have a great respect for them. Their life style and philosophy, concern for the environment is admirable.


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

Does anybody have an opinion of Danie'ls question:

'So you think it's ok for me to spray Copper this week, Actinovate next week, Serenade the next next week, and repeat ? Shouldn't I HAVE TO stick with one product ?'

Here in SW OH my early record setting 60 heirlooms have all contracted EB, I think, in various degrees. Removing all infected leaves and spraying with Daconil since most of the tops are green, growing and loaded with fruit and flowers.


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

Nothing wrong with alternating products. Many do it. Just as long as you don't mix them together and you follow the label directions for application on each.

Dave


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

But, is it better to alternate products ? Or it's better to stick with one product ?


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RE: Early blight?!?!?

Anybody...?


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