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Dekopon

Posted by hmhausman FL 10B (hmhausman@aol.com) on
Tue, Feb 22, 11 at 14:01

Has anyone heard or tried this?? See the David Karp article.

http://articles.latimes.com/2011/feb/17/food/la-fo-dekopon-20110217

Harry


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Dekopon

holy cow!!! that's a gem of a find.

According to the info from this link, If & when it goes commercial for the first time this year, i'll at least have access to the fruits. Most of those markets are within reach :)

Thanks for the heads up, Harry.

Tim

Here is a link that might be useful: dekopon/sumo citrus


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RE: Dekopon

I just tasted my first Dekopon today and it is excellent tasting. I picked it up at Nijiya Market in San Diego and the add says they are a hybrid between Kiyomi and Ponkan. I've recently been taste testing many citrus, especially the blood oranges but this Dekopon is really really good. It tastes like a cross between an orange and tangerine but has more orange flavor. It tastes nothing like other tangors or the Mineelo tangelos. The sweet to acid balance in this fruit is perfect in my opinion. Anyone know where i can pick up a tree?


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RE: Dekopon

Thanks for the report. I figure that trees are probably not available since the fruit is new to the market. The growers in the article look like a small club with a proprietary strangle hold on the trees. That's just a guess....but I'll bet I'm right.

Harry


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RE: Dekopon

""Dekopon" is actually a trademark name for Shiranui mandarin with Brix > 13.
Shiranui mandarin was not patented in Japan when discovered in 1972, due to concern about its rough appearance.
Not cold hardy -- for this reason it is mainly grown in Kyushu."

"I wrote to Gene to inquire about upcoming tours of his collection, and I mentioned the L.A. Times "Dekopon" article. He said that "Dekopon" (or whatever name you care to apply) is nucellar, and so should come "true" from seed. So anyone who's interested should start sprouting some out right away!"

http://www.cloudforest.com/cafe/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=461

A few quotes about dekopon from another website, either you need to find it's originally named scions or track down seeds. Or just give it a year or two and the hype will die down and 4 winds will carry it.

It does sound good but that is $ for citrus,
-Ethan


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RE: Dekopon

Being an avid citrus grower, I went tracking the fruit after reading that post on cloudforest too. It costs around $2+ per fruit at the local Japanese food market. So, I decided to pass. I will try to locate budwood in a few years when the hype has died down and try to graft (or wait for FourWinds to sell it, as Ethan says!).


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RE: Dekopon

looks like a bumpy tangelo. hope to be able to grow one oneday.


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RE: Dekopon

Unfortunately us FL folks are probably out of luck on this one. I guess we can always hope some fruit makes it our way and we can plants seeds, but I can't imagine we will ever be able to get budwood from CA.


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RE: Dekopon

Jsvand5,
I wonder if you could eventually import budwood from Lincove station? It is a USDA station (in CA) with certified clean citrus wood kept in a screen house. I believe the scions will eventually be open for distribution?

-Ethan


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RE: Dekopon

I read somewhere that the citrus clonal protection program has acquired budwood but is currently in quarantine. Once it is out of quarantine, they should be able to release it to the public. I've eaten 6 of the larger dekopons and not a single seed yet.

After eating so many, they are still very good but I would like to compare it to a properly ripened, properly thinned fruit from a well grown Gold Nugget just to compare.


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RE: Dekopon

That sounds awesome! Thanks for sharing the article!


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RE: Dekopon

Is sending citrus seeds to FL illegal or just budwood and trees etc illegal? Just wondering...


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RE: Dekopon

Unless things have recently changed (doubtful), you can't send anything citrus related to FL, including seeds.


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RE: Dekopon

Ahh that sucks. I am originally from CA and I really don't think the variety of citrus offered in FL is as good as what's on the west coast in general.


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RE: Dekopon

Somebody on ebay is selling Dekpon seeds. I wonder if its the real deal or if he's a fake or just sending some other citrus seeds? He has a very high rateing?


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RE: Dekopon

I thought it was seedless???


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RE: Dekopon

Some of them apparently have seeds and according to Gene Lester, they come true from seed as they are nucellar. So, if you get fresh seeds from a reliable source, you are all set! I hear that there are a lot of people in CA trying to eat a lot of Sumo fruit to track down the seeds :) (btw/ great reports of the fruit so far from people who have eaten them).


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RE: Dekopon

I just emailed the Ebay Seller of these seeds and asked him to assure me that these are indeed from this new seedless fruit....and how that is even possible....let's see what his answer is....

mangorangedog


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RE: Dekopon

Got an e-mail from Sumo and the reply was that they are looking to expand their distribution to the East Coast by next year.

I wouldn't bother spending 20 on the stuff that guy is auctioning. Just my 2cents...


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RE: Dekopon

The CCPP has some budwood in quarantine but I think its going to be a while before it gets released to the public so I went ahead and ordered the seeds from the guy on Ebay. My wife and I have eaten 12 Dekopon and not a single seed yet!

I brought a few Dekopon to work to share with my friends and some thought it was really good but not that special. Some of my friends wished it had slightly more acidity.

After eating so many Dekopons, the novely is starting to wear out. Its still good but so is a perfecty ripened Valencia, Washington Navel, or Tarocco Blood Orange.


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RE: Dekopon

Simon,
Please let me know before your next Mango pruning. Your email is disabled so I'm putting this on here.

thanks Simon

Tim


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RE: Dekopon

I'll let you know Tim. They are all still small and my Tebow died in the frost we had several days ago.
Simon


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RE: Dekopon

wow, that really sucks big time. Of all the nights, it had to be the last frost we get this year huh? I'm really sorry to hear that

Tim


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RE: Dekopon

Yeah, tim and simon - wasn't that a bummer - that LAST FREEZE - I forget what date it was in early February. I didn't lose my small mango trees, but they were severely pugged by the colder-than-predicted frost that came my way too....those little plants had been so nicely formed and pushing buds.....Yeah, that one is still eating at me, too!

grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr............

The ebay seller of Dekopon never responded to my email questioning where he got these seeds and if there was a way to reassure me that they were indeed dekopon seeds....oh well....definitely buyer be ware......

mangodogbite


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RE: Dekopon

Had my first taste of Dekopons this weekend. I only got two because they didn't look "farm fresh", more like a week plus on the shelf. But nonetheless, its delicate sweet & acid balance is perfect in my opinion. Oil from the peel is VERY sweet & aromatic too.

Oh yea, look what I found from by two Dekopons :) couldn't believe my luck cuz Simon had mentioned eating more than half a dozen without one single seed. I've never tried germinating citrus before, is it just as normal as anything else?

Tim

Photobucket

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RE: Dekopon

Tim

how would you rate these oranges to, let says, a Valencia? do the live up to the hype??

JF


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RE: Dekopon

i bought 2 from whole foods here in Chandler AZ.. 2 cost me $3.40 but they were the best citrus ive ever had


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RE: Dekopon

Joe
IMO, it definitely lives up to the hype even though the ones I had weren't all that fresh. Firm texture yet very juicy, consistent through out the entire fruit. Unlike a Navel or Valencia if allowed to sit too long. If these Dekopons are perfectly ripened, whether it be right off the tree or whatever, it's hard for anything to rival it.

I'm not big on Valencia. All the ones I've eaten are either too sweet or sour. I just can't seem to find good Valencias so the comparison is night & day if I was to give you one. The good Navels I've eaten are probably 8/10 and these Dekopons are at least 9/10...IMO.

Tim


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hmmmm

i went out and bought a gold nugget mandarin tree this weekend.. too bad dekopon aren't avail yet, but i think here in phoenix we get the occasional hard freeze which wouldn't be good for the dekopon.. at least the gold nugget is hardy down to 26


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Wow those are expensive! Good thing they taste awesome


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Tim - guess those seeds are like GOLD....good luck sprouting them (or putting them on EBay - LOL)

and ....so.....they will sprout true to type - we've already determined that????

MangoOrangePeeler


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Tim

I'm going to have to make a trip to my local whole foods and give it a try. I'm not too big on citrus but I love my Valencia and my Navel. Generally they're super sweet this year not too sweet because of the 27 in. of rain.

JF


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RE: Dekopon

Hey Tim, you are one lucky guy!!! I've eaten about three cases now and still not a single seed. I did order some seeds from Ebay but they have not arrived yet. You should plant those seeds as soon as possible. Now I'm going to have to buy another case in hopes of seeds:(
Simon


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RE: Dekopon

omg!!! this is so lame ... entire crop sold-out within one month. Now we'll have to wait for 2012's crop, does this sound like a spike in price?

Tim


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RE: Dekopon

They don't keep so well. A few of mine were actually starting to rot inside... which is very frustrating to throw away essentially a $1.50 everytime you get a bad one, also 3 boxes and not a single seed, lame.

:)


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RE: Dekopon

I'm seriously not kidding guys, on my last Dekopon fruit, I fed my wife a slice of Dekopon and got yelled at because I gave her a slice with a seed which she partially chewed and swallowed. I was so pissed off, not at my wife but that I didn't tell her I was looking for its seeds.

My last couple Dekopons started getting brown streaks in them but they still tasted fine. In my opinion, the acidity got weaker and weaker as the fruit got older. Still excellent but just slightly less acidic after a week or more.

Simon


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RE: Dekopon

Hey Tim, did your Dekopon seeds sprout? I recieved my 10 seeds I purchased online and 4 of them were mushy, 4 of them have little roots starting to poke out and 2 hard seeds that look like a root is trying to pop out.

Do these seeds have to be polyembryonic to come true to seed? Ethan mentioned that Dekopons are nucellar. Are most nucellar seeds also polyembryonic?

Simon


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RE: Dekopon

Simon,
Like all my other seeds, I removed its shells before sowing, that seems to do the trick for me. As for your questions, some other experts can answer them cuz I know nothing except eating citrus :)

Both of my seeds sprouted. Tap root on the bigger seed is around an inch long, the smaller seed barely started and couldn't be more than 1/4 in long.

I'll start a thread on this as soon as something comes up from the soil :)

good luck with yours

Tim


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RE: Dekopon

I'm glad your seeds sprouted Tim. So far, the larger seeds I got appear to be polyembryonic as it appears multiple roots are popping out. I can't wait to see what type of fruit we get in about 3-10 years! Its always nice to have a seedling grown plant because IMO they are tougher and more drought tolerant. Good luck with your Dekopon seedlings too, its a race to the finish line!
Simon


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RE: Dekopon

Well, does anyone know if these trees are available yet? Yum!@!


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I haven't seen any around but you may get lucky and find some seeds. They are supposed to come true to seed.
Simon


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RE: Dekopon

Hi Mike :-) Nope. Truly. Not yet. We've chatted a bit about this over on the Citrus Forum. Here's what I posted over there in synopsis: I pulled Dr. Kahn aside a few weeks ago when I was up at the UCR Citrus Collection, and asked her what the scoop was. Our small tour group with her at the Citrus Collection at UCR (she is the curator of the collection) were the ONLY group that got to see the Dekopon and got to taste test it. All other tour guides were too scared to allow their groups to taste test it. The budwood that was sourced recently has fallen through, but they are actively sourcing budwood. So, if they can find a reliable source, it will take about a year or so to get through quarantine. Then another couple of years to grow enough budwood to make it available to growers through CCPP. And yes, Dekopon does have seeds. Mine at the collection actually had a fair number of seeds (DON'T ASK). And, I just got 2 seeds from a Dekopon I bought at Whole Foods, which are both planted in the greenhouse. We'll see how they do. Yes, they are polyembryonic and will grow true from seed if you can identify the nuclear seedlings.

Patty S.


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RE: Dekopon

  • Posted by taka none (My Page) on
    Wed, Mar 28, 12 at 2:47

Aloha, I'm new here and nice to see I'm not the only crazy one who bought dekopon seeds off of ebay. Heard from seller these seeds are supposedly from a dekopon variant grown in Japan but not generally sold in markets because, well, it contains seeds and is a bit more disfugured. But size and, most importantly, taste is supposedly the same as the for-market dekopon. I guess we'll all find out in 5 yeras or so.
Regarding taste, I have satsuma, gold nugget, tango, dancy and ponkin, and dekopon is definitely the best tasting -- extremely sweet and fragrant with a subtle tartness. By the way, dekopons run for $2.99 each here in Hawaii, which is my excuse for paying $28 for 5 seeds off of ebay. Lol.
My questions are these -- does anyone know how tall a dekopon tree grows? (ie., is it naturally dwarfing like satsumas?) And, if not, what kind of root stock would you recommend graftubg dekopon seedling to, and at what age?
Sorry for the long post and warm mahalo for any feedback.


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RE: Dekopon

My Dekopon seedling that I ordered off ebay is growing nicely but there's no way of knowing whether it really is a Dekopon. Fortunately, after going through many cases of Dekopons, I finally have a seed. I'm going to plant it soon and hope it makes it to maturity.
Simon


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RE: Dekopon

  • Posted by taka none (My Page) on
    Thu, Mar 29, 12 at 3:57

You definitely lucked out with your one true dekopon seed, as the ebay seller readily admitted his are not the market variety but a mutated strain, which happens to contain some seeds as well as multiple bumps. But I guess seconds are better than nothing. I'm sure bare-root trees will be available for shipping to Hawaii in 5 to 7 years but it's nice to see how our variant seeds do just in case ... I'm not gettiong any younger.
I have one primo spot in my yard left for one final dwarf citrus ... so, again, if anyone knows how tall these dekopon trees grow, I would certainly appreciate this info. If it's not naturally dwarfing, I plan to graft the seedlings when they're old enough.
Warmest Mahalo,
Taka


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Simon, Who sold you the seeds? i cant find any on ebay. help!


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I can't remember the name of the seller as it was over a year ago and I just checked and can't find the same seller. There is another seller that has mutated Dekopon seeds for sale. Do you live in San Diego?
Simon


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RE: Dekopon

Simon - you lucky stiff!!!!

I just bought 10 of the sumos and no seeds thru 5 eaten. How many actual fruit did you buy and have to go thru to find this one seed?

Also, mine have all been extremely sweet but also extremely acidic (tart) at the same time. Really mouth-suckingly so....is that what everyone else's taste like????

mangobeagle


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RE: Dekopon

Hey mangodog,

I bought about 8-10 cases over the last two years and found two seeds. The seed I found last year was chewed up by my wife. The seed I found this year was planted in a small pot with bottom heat. I partially dug up the seed to see if I can successfully seperate out each one of the clones but the delicate roots appear to be entangled. There appears to be about 6 clones growing.

mangodog, If I can successfully seperate out a few of the clones, you can have one for free but it will have to be local pick up.
Simon


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Simon - cool offer!!!!

Wow, but you've got entanglement issues....but sure, let me know if you get the job done and a survivor emerges - for $50 of gas and 4 hours driving time it could be worth it!

(or am I just crazy......)

mangoNUTSandORANGEcookoo


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@ Simon,

no I do not live in san diego. I live in Whittier, about 30 minutes east of los angeles.

how come, do you have a connection in san diego!!??


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Hey kylem4711,

I was thinking I could give you a seedling but the roots are all tangled up and I'm not sure if I can detangle them without injuring them. Two stems are now popping up through the soil and I believe several more will pop up shortly.
Simon


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that would be amazing! If you are ever serious and feel comfortable I would be willing to make the drive down.

Would you be able to post a picture?


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RE: Dekopon

  • Posted by taka none (My Page) on
    Sun, Apr 22, 12 at 2:38

Aloha All,
Just got my dekopon (mutant strain with seeds) from ebay seller. Sorry, I checked and he's sold out ... he had 5 lots of 5 seeds each for $28, and I bought the 2nd of the 5.
Simon, glad I checked this forum and saw your posting about roots... I planted each of my 5 seeds separately in 3-inch pots with MiracleGro potting mix and nestled them in my planter box where it will get lots of lilght, warmth, moisture, drainage and TLC.
Taka


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RE: Dekopon

Hey kylem4711, I suck at posting pictures but I will try. I was just reminded by a member that Citrus is quarantined and cannot be moved from one area to another area outside of the quarantine zone.

Instead of risking the loss of any of the seedlings, I will probably grow them all to a large size and that way I can share budwood in the future.

taka, I also ordered Dekopon seeds online but when I purchased the seeds, they were not listed as Mutant strain. They were listed as regular Dekopon seeds. I have on seedling from those seeds that is doing very well right now but unfortunately, because I did not personally pick the seed out of a real Dekopon, I cannot be 100% sure its the real thing.

As for the real Dekopon seed I planted, I used a heat mat for bottom heat and the seed sprouted in about 2 weeks. There are still only 2 stems poking up so far. I may give it a diluted feeding with SuperThrive to help the weaker clones.
Simon


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RE: Dekopon

I finally got the seeds in the mail. Do you guys think they are real??

any tips on planting them?


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RE: Dekopon

I was at my local Home Depot in Sarasota, Florida and saw a 'Shiranui Tangerine' tree for sale. Today was apparently the first time these trees have been offered and I happened to purchase the very first one. One of the ladies from the nursery that sells them to H.D. was there setting up the display.
There was a small information pamphlet attached with a picture. It appears to be the same as this Dekopon discussed here. It is supposed to be seedless and have the single bump at the stem.
I grew up in Texas where I had the best tasting orange I can remember. It was purchased from the back of an old beat-up pickup parked on the side of the road. The Mexican gentleman selling them had a few cut in half as samples and they were the darkest orange I have ever seen. Before I moved to Florida, I really thought I would find something comparable here, but sadly, my experience with Florida oranges has been disappointing to say the least. It's almost false advertising to put an orange on our license plates if we can't grow better tasting oranges than the sickly pale ones with lackluster sweetness I've seen so far. I'm really hoping this Shiranui is as good as it sounds.
The tree is potted in a 5 gallon black nursery pot, stands appx. 3.5 feet tall, and was priced at $40, which seems pretty reasonable for a rare tree. Really, most citrus and mango trees that size are similarly priced (I payed more for a slightly smaller Jakfruit tree last year). Home Depot's nursery for these trees (at least in Florida) has a website: http://mycitrustree.com/


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RE: Dekopon

Regarding The Dekopon/Shiranui. Home Depot in Davie, Florida store 0222 (the Ft. Lauderdale, FL area) has them on order, Shiranui is available for wholesale ordering from Record Bucks. For those of you who shop at HD in South Florida, ask your store to order it for you. I'm bringing in a few at the Davie store, should be here week of 7/9/12. I will buy one for myself as the reviews here have been by and large quite excellent.


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RE: Dekopon

For anyones information, I just bought for 39.99 a three gallon pot, in Lowes, in Naples FL. with a fruit already on it. They also have a 5 gallon pot for 59.99.


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