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julia42

So how poisonous is lantana really?

julia42
13 years ago

I'm just wondering. We recently moved to a house with a really lovely lantana in the front yard. It's probably the only plant in the front yard that I like, and I would love to keep it, but I have three small boys who are, well, unpredictable. I'd love to say I should train them right and they should know not to eat random plants and all, and I know there are a million poisonous plants out there... This one seems to have pretty varying reports on its toxicity, though, from "skin irritant" to "fatal if ingested". Anyone know? Lantanas are pretty, but a dime a dozen here - I'm leaning towards taking it out.

Comments (48)

  • tx_ag_95
    13 years ago

    I don't know that I'd worry about them eating it -- it has a fragrance that "stinks" to me and the leaves are very rough. I try to wear long sleeves and gloves when I have to cut it back, even after it's died back, because it makes me itch (probably just "in my head"). I did go out and "try" a leaf, and while it didn't taste terrible, I don't think even a small boy is going to eat enough of it to do any damage. The leaves are kinda stiff & paper-y, so they'd really have to work at it! I'd compare it to trying to eat a fine-grade sandpaper.

    With it being in the front yard, what about instigating a policy of "no children in the front yard without a parent"?

    Most plants that are considered poisonous are only technically poisonous because you have to ingest such a large amount before it causes more than an upset stomach.

  • julia42
    Original Author
    13 years ago

    Well, that's sort of what I was wondering. The boys are not of an age where they'd be playing in the front yard alone, so I think I'd notice if they sat down to a full meal of the stuff. I could easily imagine my one year old popping a leaf or flower in his mouth before I caught him, though. I was more concerned if it was of a toxicity where it could do a lot of harm with just a tiny taste.

    I appreciate the input!

  • roselee z8b S.W. Texas
    13 years ago

    Hi Julia! There is a very informative article on the toxicity of plants on a site that starts with a D. Those who are familiar with the site can go there, click on articles, do a search for "plant toxicity" and find quite a few articles on the subject. Among them is an overview titled: "Toxic Plants- What Does That Really Mean"

    Your "Page" is not set up to receive email, but if you can't find the site send a email to me from "My Page" I'll give you the link.

  • wantonamara Z8 CenTex
    13 years ago

    Birds eat the seed/berry off the plant so that part can't be that toxic. My son ate his fair share of rocks. I watched him once. He was very observant and checked it out , turned it over , and thought about it, Then I saw him roll the small pebble in his mouth and then he took it out and put it back on the ground. He was very particular. He would have never even thought about Lantana as a possibility. You guys are probably thinking.....What kind of mom watches her child eat rocks. I had Larkspur in the garden. He did not like to eat green leafy things so I felt safe.

    Talk to your children about the plants. They understand more than you might guess.

  • cynthianovak
    13 years ago

    one of my dogs eats the tips of them. I can't stand to brush against them when I'm sweaty or hormonally challenged. My sister in law has a landscaper trained at A&M offering suggestions near their fence. He said lantana aren't poisonous...don't worry about the cattle eating them.

    that's all I know, my chow/ Australian shepherd dog started munching the tips of their branches years ago, most of the time he ignores them, they much do something tasty or perhaps he is self medicating.

  • plantmaven
    13 years ago

    I found this on an Aggie web site:

    Lantana Camara (Red Sage) Green berries
    Fatal. Affects lungs, kidneys, heart and nervous system. Grows in the southern U.S. And in moderate climates.

    Here is a link that might be useful: poison/toxic plants

  • cynthianovak
    13 years ago

    well that makes it clear...except for the part where my dog does fine! I suspect he is eating the berries. I notice that he hasn't been nibbling for ages. Mine are just blooming again and he is ignoring them. I will watch and see if that changes once they set berries. These are the yellow/pink variety...I believe the name is confetti.

    Soooo, I wonder if some are and some aren't and if the berries have some medicinal properties since this dog has weak i.e. sort tendons in his hips. He seems to be careful. This is not a dog that eats just anything. He's the guy who takes his part of the leftover burger, unwraps it, inspects it and leaves the pickle.

    plants are fascinating. Maybe we are the critters most likely to eat toxic plants...

    just musing
    c

  • julia42
    Original Author
    13 years ago

    Well, I don't know... Lots of animals dine on poison ivy without ill effects, too, but it certainly seems to affect us humans.

    These are the kind of discussions that led me to post in the first place. I think that Aggie website was one of the places I had initially read about it being possibly fatal. As the article on the "D" website pointed out, though, anything can be fatal in large enough quantities. Water is fatal if too much is inhaled...

    So if it's only the berries that are poisonous, are they fatal if you eat one, or 2 lbs of them?

    I do of course teach my children not to eat things they pick in the yard. I also teach them not to play with knives, but I still don't leave knives sitting out on the counter where they can reach them, you know?

  • tx_ag_95
    13 years ago

    I would think that if lantana was very poisonous, it would be well known and it wouldn't be planted everywhere. Look at nightshade for an example.

  • rock_oak_deer
    13 years ago

    Dr. Jerry Parsons, one of our local plant experts, has addressed the poisonous landscape plant issue a number of times and I have linked to one article below. This article starts off with pet issues and then moves on to children.

    He also did an article a few years ago about taking his young grandson for a walk around the neighborhood in a stroller and let him try to eat whatever plant he chose. The results were very informative and the pictures really told the story. Unfortunately, after searching several times the last few days I cannot find it.

    You can also search and find other references where he discusses this issue.

    Here is a link that might be useful: Article on Poisonous Landscape plants

  • jhix
    13 years ago

    With respeect, the differences in physiology among animals allow some to eat quantities of plant materials that would harm humans. Also, members of the same plant family may be harmless or poisionous to humans, such as bluebonnet, coral bean, locoweed, and mountain laurel, all members of the pea family. We're all aware, too, of the need to cook some plants in specific manner to reduce their toxicity, such as poke weed. And, some parts of a plant may be harmful to humans and another part may be beneficial.

    My slight knowledge is from a good resource on this topic, "Edible and Useful Plants of Texas and the Southwest", University of Texas Press, by Delena Tull. She discusses poisonous plants, including houseplants as well. When I hear comments about poisonous plants in the yard, I ask the commentator if they eat common poisonous plants such as spinach, broccoli, kale and cabbage.

  • julia42
    Original Author
    13 years ago

    While nightshade isn't used much as a landscape plant, oleander is, and it's quite poisonous. If I'd moved into a home with a stand of oleander it would have been promptly removed.

    I'm not trying to be an alarmist, but rather just hoping to get some clarification. I'm not really keen on the idea of hacking down any plant that concerns me (although I can't say I feel some sort of moral imperative to preserve a lantana). I've been able to find fairly explicit information on some poisonous plants through internet research (certain hollies, for example). Lantana happens to be one for which I haven't found satisfactory answers and some sources seem to think is fairly dangerous. I figured people here might have some insight.

  • BluebirdCaller
    11 years ago

    Just an additional thought re lantana toxicity: The seeds are very attractive to children, who are naturally curious. Recently my 3-yr-old granddaughter pointed to my lantana's glossy, blue-black seeds and said, "Look granny -- blueberries!" As you might imagine, we had an on-the-spot garden-rules-for-toddlers lesson. Even plants that are not highly toxic can have a significant impact on little 'uns.

  • beachplant
    11 years ago

    For the record, there has NEVER been an accidental death or major poisoning from oleanders. Ever. Not people, not animals. Never. They taste too horrible. People has committed suicide, attempted to poison others and poisoned animals but noone has ever died or become violently ill from ACCIDENTAL ingestion of oleanders. Mom could always tell when we were playing in the oleanders, it is the only time we ever washed our hands without being told. It tastes HORRIBLE, bitter, nasty, you start spitting if you want to or not. Even suicides fail as they can't eat enough of it.

    Tally HO!

  • cynthianovak
    11 years ago

    Tally!

    what a fascinating job. Do you for for a poison hot line?
    Lucky us to get such great info from a great Tx gardener. Thank you!
    c

  • tx_ag_95
    11 years ago

    I was told/taught that the problem with oleanders was inhaling the smoke when the branches were burned. Our neighbors, growing up, had a row of the bushes and that's what I remember my parents telling me...but maybe by then we'd shown that we wouldn't eat something that wasn't food?

  • beachplant
    11 years ago

    I work for The Poison Control Center. There are 6 centers in Texas, I work at the Galveston center aka The Southeast Texas Poison Control Center. Open 24 hours a day, 365 days a year, always free, always staffed by highly trained medical professionals. :)

    Oleander SMOKE can be toxic, but it is very irritating and most people don't stand in the smoke for long. I couldn't find any reports of anyone dying from smoke inhalation while burning oleanders. Being outside helps. If I had a dollar for everyone that tells me they are freaked out and whacking down their oleanders I would be retired. Pothos are probably my most common plant calls.

    If you call us we will send you Mr. Yuck stickers, coloring books, brochures on toxic plants, etc.

    Tally HO!

  • Lin barkingdogwoods
    11 years ago

    Hey Tally - not to get too far off the topic of lantana, but what about Castor beans? We have a gorgeous Castor bean plant growing in the library garden, in the back by the wall. We received calls this past weekend on that being the most poisonous plant in the world (ricin is made from it).

    What kind of danger does castor bean plant present?

    Thanks!

    Lin

  • beachplant
    11 years ago

    if you swallow the seeds none, if you chew them up then they are extremely toxic. The prickly seed pods deter most kids and adults. You can buy the seeds at any garden center. They are a gorgeous small tree here, annual in the north. There are castor beans on my desk, along with sago seeds (highly toxic), beauty berry, palm, mushrooms and whatever else I stick in my pockets on my walks through campus.

    The most famous poisoning case in the world was with ricin.
    Georgi Markhov, dissident, suspected spy, was brushed by a passerby with an umbrella, he died a few days later of ricin poisoning, at autopsy a tiny metal ball was found in his leg, it had tiny perforations in it and was filled with ricin. The Bulgarian secret police remain the main suspects.
    Tally HO!

  • texasredhead
    11 years ago

    How large is this lantana? Sure your not talking about Oleander? There are many toxic plants, none more toxic than the toadstools that often grow in my lawn. Tomatos are delicious but the plant is toxic. If you have children that have a habit of putting things in their mouths, you might ought to remove anything potentialy toxic.

  • beachplant
    11 years ago

    most of the mushrooms that grow in your lawn, especially after the rain, are known as lbm-or little brown mushrooms, they vary from snow white to earth brown and can actually be fairly large. They are gi irritants. Meaning they are most likely to cause gi irritation-nausea, vomiting and diarrhea.

    Removing toxic plants can be near impossible, most ingestions by children are 1-2 bites and not toxic.
    Tally HO!

  • Geenan
    10 years ago

    My dog eats one particular weed. He searches for it. We call it his "salad"... Our vet was so intrigued that he sent it to a friend at A&M to find out what it was. Turns out it is a wild Lantana. Don't know if it blooms... he never lets it get big enough. If he couldn't find it, though, he ate other larger Lantanas.

  • roselee z8b S.W. Texas
    10 years ago

    Greenan, that's really interesting. There must be some medicinal properties in the leaves that he needs, likes, or something. My dogs like to chew on Echinacea, which is a well known medicinal herb, Also Black foot daisy, which I don;t know about. But at least they don't take enough to damage the plants. They are not 'chewers' by nature and those are the only plants I've noticed they nibble on.,

  • julia42
    Original Author
    10 years ago

    I was surprised to find this discussion still going on.

    The lantana stills lives in my front yard, although I do keep threatening to hack it down. Not so much because I'm worried about its toxicity but because I keep thinking I could put something more interesting in its place. Then it blooms and I leave it... Oh well - maybe someday.

    My youngest has reached the ripe ole age of four, and I can mostly count on him to not eat random stuff these days...

    And Roselee, my dog loves echinacea too. Also lemon verbena and stevia and oregano. And his name is Basil!

  • vcrosstx
    10 years ago

    One of my dogs would eat lantana in the yard almost every evening and would immediately throw up. I don't know why she kept doing it, so I pulled it out! I only keep lantana in the front yard now. I agree with previous posters. It stinks!!!

  • passaflora
    9 years ago

    In the latest email newsletter from "Eat the Weeds" it discussed lantana. The green berries are extremely poisonous but the ripe purple black ones usually cause no problems. it also discusses the edibility of the plant and some other uses for it and additional links.
    http://www.eattheweeds.com/newsletter-18-november-2014/

    In response to the post by beachplant oleanders are extremely poisonous one leaf is enough to kill a horse. I personally know of a case where someones horse ate a few dried leaves and died a horrible death from oleanders
    here is a link from the American Cancer Society and the pet Poision hotline reguarding Olanders

    Also according to the the howstuffworks website it is considered by many to be the most poisionous plant in the world. link included below

    http://www.cancer.org/treatment/treatmentsandsideeffects/complementaryandalternativemedicine/herbsvitaminsandminerals/oleander-leaf

    http://www.petpoisonhelpline.com/poison/oleander/

    http://adventure.howstuffworks.com/top-5-poisonous-plants10.htm

    nancy

  • Creative Cookie
    8 years ago

    Hi, Tally and all.

    Need your professional opinion on this.

    My parents live in Malaysia. An equatorial country above Singapore.

    Our dog Roger frequently has an upset stomach. However the vets we've seen aren't taking our complaints seriously.

    When he gets these episodes, he loves to eat lantana leaves. I've also noticed that our dog Jessie and our cats love the leaves too (though they do not have stomach issues).

    Lantana leaves are Roger's first choice. I've seen him chewing on another leaf from a pansy-like flowering plant when lantana is not available.

    Based on these conditions, a local equatorial climate, do you think the lantana plant here is poisonous to our pets? It is sunny and rainy all year round. And very humid.

    As children we have often eaten ripe black lantana berries. Our parents were the ones who told us they were edible. Didn't have any stomach issues then.

    I have read more than once that the skin and seeds of most fruit contain substances that are toxic to dogs, includng persin, oxalates, atrophine and cyanide. What do the skin and seeds of lantana berries contain?

    Looking forward to hearing from you soon, Tally.

    :)


    - Shai

  • Jeanette Wallace
    8 years ago

    I was reading in the comments about oleanders, always wear goggles when cutting the limbs, my husband had to go to eye dr his eyes were affected very badly from cutting the limbs. Very poisonous to the eyes

  • rivercityrrs
    7 years ago

    I am a longtime dog breeder and have had lantana on my property for 30 years. All that time, generations of my dogs have grazed on the lantana (confetti). I have no grass, so this is the main way they get their own greens. I planted more lantana 2 years ago (orange and yellow variety) so they wouldn't overgraze the first plants and kill them. Some dogs eat the leaves, others the flowers. No problems - until this year. One of my dogs has gone through 2 episodes of illness; won't eat, feels terrible, jaundice, liver values WAY high, white cell count elevated. Only toxin he has access to is lantana, and he probably does eat more of it than any of the other dogs. His symptoms (episodic) and the high-res ultrasound of his liver ($$$$$) indicate no liver disease, and we believe the problem was the lantana. I really like the lantana, but I really love the dogs, so tore the lantana out and now have them only in containers in a side yard that the dogs don't have access to. Have planted some containers of winter wheat grass that I can rotate out of doggy areas, and give them spinach, mustard greens, collard greens, broccoli stalks, etc to satisfy their green cravings. So far, so good. Is this dog more sensitive to the liver toxin than all the others over all these years? Don't know. Is the yellow and orange variety more toxic than confetti? Also don't know. I DO know that with no access to the lantana my boy is happy, playing, hunting and eating.

  • roselee z8b S.W. Texas
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    rivercityrrs, thank you very much for giving us the helpful details about your experience with dogs eating lantana. It is most mysterious and very intriguing how so many dogs seem to enjoy grazing on it, according to the above posts as well as yours, but your one dog had such a negative reaction.

  • Jacqueline Lawther
    7 years ago

    Beachplant I'm sorry but oleander is so toxic that even enough just to know you don't like it could kill you. Children are curious. I am also a horse owner and have heard stories from friends on several separate occasions of trimmings being mulched with grass clippings and then given as a "treat" to neighbors horses. Most horse owners know not to feed grass clippings but most neighbors do not. In any case, the horses are usually dead before the plant is even swallowed. INCREDIBLY HIGHLY TOXIC.

  • buttoni_8b
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    When I lived in Texas City, I had 50 oleanders lining my back yard cedar fence. Monsters to keep pruned back, but they get fuller, bloom more and really benefit from heavy pruning each year (like almost to the ground pruning). A former neighbor in Galveston who was in the Oleander Society there told me that. She had the rarest, deep, dark burgundy one in her front yard I have ever seen in my life. The one in my yard were pale pink and truly gorgeous. They never bothered my 3 dachshunds I raised at that house, despite the fact they shed blossoms and leaves all over the ground below year round. Only reason I wouldn't plant oleanders up here in Central TX, where I am now, is I have back problems and can't do as much yard work as I once could. They really prefer to be out in the open, in a focal setting, uncrowded, so they can get full sun all-around to show off their best.

  • lucillle
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    I have several lantanas, one that regularly gets so large it has to be whacked back. I've never had any ill effects from doing so.

    Had an oleander in the back yard, took some time to kill it because it would always try to grow back, but finally after multiple applications of Roundup it croaked last year. I had debated what to do about it for a while, but finally decided it is simply too toxic in my opinion to take a chance with in my back yard where there are my dogs and where the grand baby may someday play.


    Did a search for accidental oleander poisoning, found one right away. While it does not appear common, I don't want it to happen to my family when removing it would remove the danger.


    Fatal oleander poisoning

  • roselee z8b S.W. Texas
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    Perhaps some would like to read what Snopes says in answer to an inquiry about the toxicity of oleander.

    Not to downplay the toxicity of oleander, but this is their conclusion as far as human consumption:

    "Conclusion: Hot dogs cooked on Nerium oleander branch skewers contain a negligible amount of oleandrin. Poisoning by consuming hot dogs or other food items cooked on oleander branches is probably an urban myth."

    Also this: "County officials sought to calm community fears that the thousands of
    oleander plants in and around Los Angeles pose a public health threat.

    "Normal
    children don't go out and eat oleander," said Dr. Richard Clark, a
    medical toxicologist and executive director of the California Poison
    Control Center. And even if they did, Clark added, they would either gag
    on the bitter plant or vomit it.

    "There is not a single other
    case in the American literature that I know of of people eating oleander
    leaves and dying," he said."

    That one case is related here.


    Edit: Oh, I see that the same link was also posted above.

  • wantonamara Z8 CenTex
    7 years ago

    Did you know that the most common calls for pet plant poisonings are due to azaleas and lilies. Do you hear about people ripping them out? I lived in Hawaii, Thailand and the Caribbean. I don't remember one dog dying of oleander and god knows it was everywhere, nor of anyone telling me to not gnaw on the oleander. Maybe they did but I was so young I didn't remember NOW there was a poison tree that we all were told about to stay away from and not even sit under. Do we have children chewing on poison ivy, popping hemlock and larkspur? I often feel that this line of thinking is insulting to our children. They need to learn that the world is not a safe space and that it is easy to learn about it without fear. What a great place for an adult to have that communication with the child but in the garden. Most poisonings are in the home anyway.

  • lucillle
    7 years ago

    It's true, children eventually need to learn, but it is a process, and they need to live long enough to learn. MANY children die from poisoning of one sort or another, so telling them alone is inadequate.

  • roselee z8b S.W. Texas
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    True. Household substances are the most common toxic items that children ingest and are what adults must be careful not to leave where children can get to them. Grandparents must always be careful with their medications, cleaning products, fertilizers and insecticides because ofttimes we don't know when grandchildren are going to visit.

    "Cosmetics and personal care products lead the list of the most common substances implicated in pediatric exposures
    (children younger than 6 years, NPDS, 2014). Cleaning substances and
    pain medications follow. These exposures are nearly always
    unintentional." From: http://www.poison.org/poison-statistics-national

  • wantonamara Z8 CenTex
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    Does anyone here now of a child personally who was poisoned eating plants? Where is Tally when we need her! My son was under supervision when he was outside. That guy was an escape artist . No gate was good enough to hold him in. He was more endangered by being run over. I should have posted a baby crawling crossing sign on my street.

  • lucillle
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    Everyone raises children differently, and everyone (and sometimes, society) decides what level of risk they are willing to accept in their environment for themselves, their family and their pets/critters.


  • daninthedirt (USDA 9a, HZ9, CentTX, Sunset z30, Cfa)
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    I read in a veterinary website that a toxic dose for Lantana is 1% of body weight. I suspect it's something like that for a human. That's a LOT of Lantana. You can do bad things to yourself by ingesting 1% of your body weight in dirt. So obviously we need to remove all dirt from a yard where kids might be playing.

  • wantonamara Z8 CenTex
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    The lantana could be an accumulative thing like many allergies are.. I think it is about education because if you go through the websites about what is poisonous and walk around your yard, you will be pulling out so many amazing things and one will be left with not very much.

    I saw one article where only 3 people died of plant poisonings in 2014 and that includes mushrooms. The deaths were not children but people foraging for wild herbs and mistaking them. I think the parents are looking after their children well mostly.

  • Deborah Domenici
    7 years ago

    I'd like to talk to Geenan. My dog also seeks out lantana. She stops at any lantana bush she can find. I never let her eat much. But she has eaten it for years. I can't stand to have her on a leash for the major part of our 45 minute wallk a day at the park. It's her only time of the day. Where she can sniff what she wants-and be a real dog. But I sometimes wonder-if it could have cumulative damage. A little bit of a poison that has a toxic effect over time. Like cancer-that starts and sometimes takes years to kill-very scary. Because my dog is my life.

  • PKponder TX Z7B
    7 years ago

    Don't let her eat lantana. I doubt that any studies have been done as to the cumulative effects of consuming lantana.

    You might try sending a private message to Geenan since that post was 3 + years ago. I really don't recall seeing that poster recently on this forum.


  • daninthedirt (USDA 9a, HZ9, CentTX, Sunset z30, Cfa)
    7 years ago

    As I said, it takes a LOT of Lantana to make for a toxic dose. That's documented. And yes, I don't there there is any evidence that the toxicity of Lantana is cumulative such that toxicity is based on how much you've eaten in a lifetime. I strongly suspect it gets expelled with everything else. It takes a few days for the lantana toxicity to manifest itself, I believe.

    You get your stomach pumped for poison mainly because that's a lot faster way to get rid of it than how you would naturally get rid of it.

  • PKponder TX Z7B
    7 years ago

    It sounded like Deborah Domenici would be devastated if her dog were poisoned. Why take a chance?

  • hajman123
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    My friend’s dog munched on an oleander bush and got super sick, went into renal failure and almost died. $5000 later, he‘s fine. Bush is gone, lesson learned by everyone!

  • roselee z8b S.W. Texas
    4 years ago

    So sorry to hear about your friend's dog getting sick, but glad he's okay. That's quite a hefty vet bill. As our expert Tally said above usually oleanders are so bitter that it's not nibbled by dogs, but there's always an exception. Thank you for the warning and letting us know that it can happen.

    Sago palms are another story. It's not at all unusual to hear about dogs chewing on the seeds and dying. When he was a young pup I saw Alfie starting to chew on the new sprouts around the bottom of my 30 year old mature Sagos. I prompty cut the sprouts back and surrounded the trees with heavy black plastic and then covered the plastic with a VERY thick layer of mulch. It's been almost three years. No more sprouts and the dogs and trees are fine.

    It all these years my female tree has only flowered three or four times. I carefully remove the seeds before they fall.

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