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gayle0000

Cleaning up the brambles. help!

gayle0000
16 years ago

I am in the process of buying a house (I Close in a couple weeks!). I love gardening & quite experienced in it. I look forward to many new outdoor projects to be done over the years, but have never had anything woodsy. The double lot in town is wooded and overgrown in the "second" lot. No one has taken care of this section of the yard for many years.

Below is a pic taken today of a part of the yard (it's the only pic I have & I really don't know how it looks with foliage other than from a distance). This section is full of brambles. I definitely want to keep the area woodsy, but it needs some strategic cleaning. Does anyone know if cleaning up these brambles is a DIY job over time, or am I better off calling in a pro and setting a plan up?

I appreciate any thoughts.

{{gwi:1352725}}

Comments (22)

  • bob64
    16 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    You can do it yourself. However, the picture doesn't suggest any great need for attention. I suppose it depends what you want to do with the land. It might also look different in summer I suppose. You might want to observe the land for a full year to see what it does over the seasons. That would help with making a plan. FYI, when I think of brambles I usually think of blackberries and rasberries, etc. I see more saplings than anything else in the photo. My personal preference is to leave the saplings alone so they can help to replace the mature trees as they die.

  • doriang
    16 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Hi! I agree with the above post -- consider letting it sit for a year, and document what kind of species you have there.

    It does look like largely saplings -- seedlings of the larger trees growing (locust? - can't tell from the bark. Norway maple is very common in some areas too). If you'd like a more cultivated look, perhaps think of defining the woodland's edge -- plant with hostas and astilbes, backing up to some shade-loving shrubs. Cultivating a 2 foot wide strip for planting is a bit of work, but can be handled with pruning shears and a sharp shovel (if you do it by hand, you can avoid the large tree root, something a backhoe would likely destoy -- and kill off).

    Consider potting up some of the saplings you remove -- and trade them for other plants with your new neighbors!

    Also -- native plants are a wonderful choice for woodlands. Many are spring flowering, taking advantage of the spring sunlight, and then you may enjoy the cool shade in the summer. Hope this helps.

  • gayle0000
    Original Author
    16 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Thanks for your responses so far. Yes, I agree 100% about waiting a year, and I do not know what kind of trees these are. As I said, I do not live here yet, so no opportunity to spend time with them yet.

    I was planning on waiting a year to address ANY plants. Former owners haven't done any landscaping around the house except for a couple sheared down burning bushes in the front. I'm also waiting a year to even come up with ideas on that. This photo is only about 1/4 of the "wooded" part of the yard, so there is a lot more than just this area. The whole wooded area is like this, so there really is a lot of work...even in just cleaning up the fallen limbs (that area is not shown on the pic).

    I'm truly excited about the home and lot because it is truly a blank slate and I see it more as a work in progress than a chore.

    I agree they are "saplings". I called them brambles because in many areas, these saplings are very close together and it's just become out of control.

    For the wooded part, I want it mostly natural with maybe some smaller clearings established as focal points and surprises. Shade gardening is my first love when it comes to gardening (a hosta collector to be more precise), so you can be assured Hosta will be added at some point.

    Also...I'm rambling now...this home/lot is in town. It's a double lot (not that common in my city), so I'm wanting to use some of the space for gardening and playing, but still keep it fairly wooded. Might as well use it if I have it, you know? To me, these "woods" are prime real estate for where I live, and for being a gardener.

    So, I guess what I'm really asking...it sounds like removing saplings as shown in the pic is a DIY job? Sounds like it is...and the more I think about it, I think it's do-able. It's just not something that's going to happen very fast.

  • joepyeweed
    16 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I would identify everything that is growing there. So you may need to let suff leaf out to identify it. If you're really good you can identify without leaves, but I am not that good from a picture.

    Living in central Illinois, My guess would be that many of those small scrubby things are probably sugar maples or buckthorn that need to be removed. And its not that hard to do...

    If you know which ones are scrub, remove them. And then wait.... my experience with woodlands such as this in central illinois, if the area hasn't been too disturbed (which looks that way), is that when the invasive understory trees are removed, there is a remnant native seed bank that will re-emerge. Nothing is growing there now because its been too shady.

    Where in Central Illinois are you? There are some demonstration plots of woodland management in the Peoria area.

  • mbuckmaster
    16 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Wow, I'd give a kidney to have an "overgrown" woods look like that right at first. I have so many invasive vines and rosa multiflora/blackberry brambles that I can't even access some areas without a machete. =)

    Looks like you have some work to do with the invasive saplings, but not too bad. It could be worse!!

  • aphrodite
    16 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I see a meandering path with some flowering shrubs here and there.....my favorite kind of garden, low maintenance and shady plants.

  • giantslug
    16 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    My advice is identify everything that is growing there first. Post photos at the Name That Plant forum if you can't ID them yourself. Then remove all the invasive exotic species if there are any present (buckthorn, shrub honeysuckle, garlic mustard etc).
    Thin out and/or move some of the native shrubs and saplings so there is room to work with.
    Make some mulch paths and plant your shade garden.
    If you are lucky enough to have native woodland plants and spring ephemerals there, incorporate them into your plantings!

  • gayle0000
    Original Author
    16 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Thanks for everyone's input! I almost posted this question on the landscaping forum, but I really wanted to concentrate on the woodsiness of it all first. I've got some great advice so far, and I thank you again!
    Gayle

  • arcy_gw
    16 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I think you are going to be a bit surprised in a very short time. Your lot looks like ours right now. Come a month or two and you would not be able to see the house from where the camera was standing. You will be amazed at what all will come up this spring. We found Jack-in-the pulpits, soloman's seal, trilliums,wild leaks and more. We cut out many of the smaller scrub trees to allow the more established to grow. This increased the wild flowers that then had sun and water. We raised the canopy too. Our goal was to get a breeze to the house as the mosquitoes were so terrible. Every year or so my husband goes through with a weed wacker and cuts down all the invasives and saplings. Even so once we get leaf out we won't see our neighbors until Fall!

  • dandy_line (Z3b N Cent Mn)
    16 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Go buy a machete and start chopping. All those small saplings will kill every thing on the ground underneath.
    I think I detect some Buckthorn in the foreground. Good luck.

  • ncdirtdigger
    16 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I would not use the machete, as the sapllings will resprout with multiple trunks.
    I use a mattock to remove the saplings,roots and all. I'll tell you it's not easy work (I wouldn't endeavor to do it if I didn't have my pool to jump in and cool off).
    I would definately follow the advise to let it leaf out so you could ID the saplings. I found several azaleas, a fringe tree, and several dogwoods.

  • terrene
    16 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Ditto Giantslug's advice. ID what is growing on your lot, and remove or kill the non-native invasive species. Your state may have a list of noxious weeds you can use to help ID and remove the offenders.

    My lot was infested with noxious weeds when I moved here, including 5 large Norway maples (only 1 left). Just removing the invasives has changed the landscape, a dense woodland became an open woodland, shady dry areas have opened up. With the invasives removed, then I can start the real landscaping and planting of natives.

    Btw, I have removed lots of Buckthorn, both Common and Glossy, both prohibited plants in Massachusetts, and I don't see any Buckthorn there in your pic.

  • gayle0000
    Original Author
    15 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    It's 3 months later and I thought I'd give an update. I always like it when someone has a question and they give an update after time has gone by, so I thought I would do so.

    1. I'm overrun with Buckthorn and Garlic Mustard. There are some good trees around, some wild mockoranges, and lots of maple saplings.

    2. The soil is great. Now that I see what I've got, I've already started clearing out some of the junk...but I've got a long ways to go.

    3. Not much for desireable woodland plants as it turns out. However, the property is a blank slate and I'm so happy with what I have!

    Thanks for the responses when I originally posted!

    I have a Blog and show some of what has been going on at my place. Feel free to take a look!
    Gayle

    Here is a link that might be useful: Gayle's Blog

  • myrtle_59
    15 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I agree, wait through one spring and summer to see what you have. Then, when the leaves are down and you know what you don't want (for me that is blackberries gone wild and barberry - hate those thorns) get out some long handled lopers and snip them one at a time at the base. When you have cut a bunch, then feed them through a chipper of appropriate size. If you are talking about sapling trees, I would just leave them myself unless you want more grass to cut, more weeds to pull .... Take a year and id the trees. You might find you have some interesting and decorative things like witchhazel, bladderwort, spice bush, paw paw not to mention a dogwood or redbud etc etc which I find very attractive.

  • myrtle_59
    15 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Sorry, I missed your update and when I saw it didn't know how to edit my response. Enjoy your new canvas!

  • arcy_gw
    15 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Don't assume too soon "Not much for desireable woodland plants" You may find after all the clearing you did you made it more desirable for some seeds to mature and next spring you may get some surprises. I considered taking a blow torch to my ground to see what I could encourage to sprout. Fire has a way of rejuvenating some dormant woodland flowers....

  • amyruth33
    15 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I pull the garlic mustard before it goes to seed and now 4 years later, I am making some headway. Unfortunately, it will always be reseeded in this area as there is such a big problem. My woodland is over run with invasives like japanese barberry which can be cut and immediately pained with roundup full strength. There is also a tool called a weed wrench which is used to pull up things such as autumn olive, roses and others. Check out their website.

    Once these invasives are out the challenge becomes what to plant in their place. It was recommended to me to plant native grasses and wildflowers. There is an interesting web retailer Prairie Moon Nursery who sell native seed mixes and explain how to establish in your woodlands, etc.

    Hope this helps.

  • joepyeweed
    15 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Thanks for the update. In Central Illinois the maple saplings are not necessarily desirable. Did you see the front page article in the Peoria Journal Star on Sunday?

    You may still have a dormant understory seedbank, but you won't know until you open up the canopy by removing the saplings and then wait a couple growing seasons.

    You never answered my question about Where in Central Illinois are you? There is a demonstration plots of woodland management at Camp Wokanda. And there will soon be a second demonstration site at Daysprings Church near Eastside Center in East Peoria. If you are close to either of those locations, I would encourage you to check them out.

  • gayle0000
    Original Author
    15 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Hey Amyruth...thanks for the info. Do you have any problems with garlic mustard coming up into your lawn? I have a ton of it in my lawn. Have been researching, and I do think I can get ahead of it the more I learn about the plant. It's just going to take a while.

    Joepyeweed...I'm from Normal. I did not see the PJS issue, but without reading it, I can probably guess the following pic is a good example of why maple saplings aren't desireable...because there can be a LOT of them:

    {{gwi:1352726}}

    That's in my side yard on the "second" lot. That's not even the worst of it...just a random photo I took in an area I haven't explored much...just for reference and winter studying when I get around to that area.

    I really need to explore the Peoria area a lot more. I go there a lot for work and I see so many things. Just never make the time to go over there for fun.

    Gayle

  • tkhooper
    15 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    You nailed my question pretty much. I to just bought a home which has a woodland area. I love it but want to be able to walk through it. Something that is hard to do right now. I have blackberry and fox grape in it as well as a number of different trees. But I would like to clear it out to the point that I can walk through it and add some shade plants that aren't there right now.

  • evonnestoryteller
    15 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I had a heavily brambled area that was supposed to be a right-of-way. I tipped the hand mower up to a 90 degree angle and went for it. Grass established, the area also flourished with wild strawberries, devil's paintbrushes and a lot of other wild flowers. It was a lot more difficult than it sounds and worked out nicely. Most projects are not that straight forward though.

    What I see a lot of people do is start at the edges of the property and work their way out. I love woodland gardening! Depending upon the situation, you can probably cut a balance between...

    maintenance,
    progress,
    urgent issues and
    final goals.

    For maintenance, a lot of people have it somewhat clear around the house. I would be sure that this part of the property is set and work my way out.

    Progress is starting from maintenance and working your way out. Where I garden, I only have a small patch of woods. My brother has a much larger patch. It is really interesting being right with the plants if you are not too much in a hurry to get everything cleared. I have lots of plants that come back every year that are really wonderful. I can give a whole tour any time of the growing year to point out interesting plants. The children love to hear about pokeberry and how the pokeberry ink was used to write the constitution.

    The thing is, all different kinds of plants will become obvious during the year. Trilliums (my brother has these) are so lovely! They can get completely lost in a rushed clearing.

    I start at the edges and remove trees, brush and brambles that are invasive, diseased or crowded out to unhealthy have some of the nicer specimens flourish. Sometimes even a broken dying stump as artistic value. I have gone to garden areas where they have done wonderful things and photographed the stumps! While clearing, I am watching for those lovely surprises by my feet. Trilliums, wild lily of the valley, star flowers really make the place a special home!

    Urgent issues may come up from time to time. My brother has some wetlands, and wetter property in his woods. He did find it necessary to go on a project to clear out some trees and concentrate on important issues. He had to remove a lot of the Virginia creeper that was choking some house stomping sized trees. This year that is his largest concentration.

    Final goals can be considered at every point of the project. Even while working on urgent issues, if you have discovered some native or desirable plants, you can probably stick a few in the ground so they can be populating. While clearing, you can be making the path, if you are thinking about a certain route through the woods. I grew up where there were several paths crossing paths through the woods to get to special places. I could branch off towards different springs, to the abandoned quarry or go directly to the pond or visit a friend.

    Gardening is an ongoing project. I would keep it to enjoyable levels. A couple years from now you will sit back and enjoy your artistic endeavor and think about how you would never arrive.

  • arcy_gw
    15 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I can't believe I did it. The last bit on my side yard is cleared. I thought I was done and would just let it be. It gets to be a lot of fighting off weeds, saplings etc. We are putting in a fire pit near that side of the house and I decided I needed to give us something nicer to look at. Now I will be able to look out my bedroom window and see some nice garden. When it cools off a bit I will start the job of dividing and transplanting. The planting is always more fun than the clearing. I can't decide if I will go exclusively with naturals i.e Jacks, trillium,bane berry, soloman's seal or should I add some light and go with verigated hosta, snow on the mountain, etc. I will have to think on that.