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john_d31

Myhtical gardens

John_D
18 years ago

Have any of you ever written about the Garden of Eden or other mythical gardens?

Comments (12)

  • John_D
    Original Author
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Make that "Mythical" -- I shouldn't type when I'm this tired.

  • eddie_ga_7a
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I wrote about the garden in my future and at the pace I'm going, it is pretty much mythical. Read about it at the link below. I have gotten more comments off this article than any other. One woman said she was touched by it, another said she almost cried. I have run out of pens so I simply break off a little piece of my heart and write with that.

    Here is a link that might be useful: And I love Her

  • John_D
    Original Author
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    This is not only a lovely piece of writing, it's also proof that you understand gardens.

  • katycopsey
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I have not written about the gardens themselves, but I have done a piece on the writers of old gardens. The Garden of Gilgamesh, Eden-type Persian gardens, Alcinoos Illiad/Oddysey and a wonderful piece by a 15th century monk The Hypnerotomachia Poliphili. All these were imaginery, but based on what the authors were seeing around them, so they can be taken somewhat as original documentation of gardens and their design. The article then wanders into more modern authors like the Greek and Roman writings.

    Just because it is Saturday evening - and I had a great day in the garden and garden stores, I have pasted it below. Alas it was published in non-online newsletter, so I cannot link to it directly.

    Greek, Roman and other older authors

    Many times when we read books or articles they have a sprinkling of quotes from horticulturists of years gone by. That is all well and good if you use the article or book for information only, but if you need to write, it is useful to be able to insert your own little quotes from these classic fellows. So this is an attempt to give a broad overview of the differences between these writers so that you can perhaps target the right one, if you need to. They also make great reading!

    When looking for historical horticultural information, there are two sorts of documents used. The early stories/epics of the ancient world and factual accounts of flora /agriculture and natural sciences of the time. The two main epics - Gilgamesh (the oldest) and Illiad and The Oddysey (Greek) are the most frequently quoted, but others, such as the Hypnerotomachia Poliphili which was written in the middle ages (1450), are also occasionally quoted.

    Very little factual accounts, if anything, from before the Greeks has survived, and only a few Greek manuscripts survived. The Romans, however, were prolific writers, and much more survives courtesy translations over the years by Arabians scholars and in more recent years the monasteries.

    The Epic of Gilgamesh is interpreted from ancient cunieforms (on clay tablets) written in Akkadian (Babylonian dialect) and translated. Story dates to at least 7th C BC. The epic tracks Gilgamesh, who is based on an historic Mesopotamian leader, and who is part human and part god. Gilgamesh goes through many trials against the gods, but from a horticultural standpoint, there are some interesting areas that illustrate the fact that even the gods had to eat and have a garden. We learn the fate of the 'date gardener' who brought baskets of dates to the Princess Ishtar. The Princess Ishtar was the spoiled daughter of the Sky god, Anu.

    This is seen again in the Jeweled Garden which contains
    ..'trees of precious stones,
    and he went straight to look at them.
    The tree bears carnelian as its fruit,
    laden with clusters (of jewels), dazzling to behold,
    - it bears lapis lazuli as foliage,
    bearing fruit, a delight to look on."

    The Greek epic tale of The Odyssey, by Homer, is also a tale of gods versus the humble human beings. Odysseus goes through many trials against supernatural beasts and scenarios. However, for all this, the gardens of the gods are fabulous, but definitely productive:

    'A fence runs around it on both sides.
    And in that place tall blossoming trees are growing.
    Pears, and pomegranates, apple trees with shining fruit,
    and sweet fig trees and blossoming olive trees.
    Of these the fruit never perishes and never leaves fall off
    In wintertime or summertime, all the year round. But always
    A blowing West Wind makes some grow and ripens others.'

    Theophrastus was another Greek, born around 370 BC, and a student of Plato. He was a fellow student with, then student of, Aristotle in the School at Athens. He succeeded Aristotle as head of the School after the death of Aristotle. Of the many works that he authored, only a few survive, but the most notable is his Enquiry into Plants. His books are one of the earliest surviving horticultural discourses. Here Theophrastus methodically divides horticultural specimens into discrete groups.

    'A trees is a thing which springs from the root with a single stem, having knots and several branches, and it cannot be easily uprooted;
    A shrub is a thing which rises from the root with many branches;
    An under-shrub is a thing which rises from the root with many stems as well as many branches;
    A herb is a thing which comes up from the root with its leaves and has no main stem, and the seed is borne on the stem; for instance corn and pot herbs'.

    Having placed the plants into suitable categories, Theophrastus then discusses how to cultivate and propagate the plants. Of particular note is that he distinguishes soil types of the regions, and the difference in characteristics between wild plants and their domesticated equivalents. Philosophically problematic areas in these earlier observations are evident. In observing the seed of trees which produce new trees, Theothrastus correlates that plants, which produce a fine down, must somehow do the same, but that must be alongside the traditional 'spontaneous ways of which the natural philosophers tell'

    'Anaxagorus says that the air contains all the seeds of all things, and that these, carried down by the rain, produce plants; Diogenes says that this happens when water decomposes and mixes in some sort with the earth'

    - this logic being based on the fact that the usually barren earth, spontaneously brings forth many seedlings after a storm or rain event.

    Things had moved along by the time the Romans held the reigns to the Mediterranean area. Being good in battle was sometimes rewarded by the Empire and thus a group of wealthy Roman gentleman farmers, as well as philosophers came into being. These, like there predecessors in other cultures, did till the land and plant and learn the art of farming. However, the divisions between the physical farmer and the landowner, were starting to show up.

    The Roman, Marcos Cato (234-149BC) wrote a short matter of fact treaty on agriculture. The observations of Cato regarding how to run a farm illustrate some of the overlooked areas of Roman society such as their superstitions and religious needs. The instructions for running a farm at a profit are laid out in detail, but with particular attention being given to the governing duties of the overseer, who 'must not gadabout, he must always be sober, and must not go out to dine'. If you are near a city or town, recommended crops include a list of flowers that can be used for garlands. Of course attention is also given to which duties need to be performed 'in the dark of the moon' and which duties must be done (or not done) within seven days of the full moon. And whilst modern science has perhaps over ruled this, I was told never to start a new project on the waning moon, so it has persisted nevertheless.

    Marcus Terentius Varro (116BC -27AD) wrote several books collectively called 'On Agriculture', but whereas Cato's writings were businesslike and to the point, Varro has a much more light hearted approach. His writings include a cynical report on the now decadent Roman Empire.
    '..all the heads of families have sneaked within the walls, abandoning the sickle and the plough, and would rather busy their hands in the theatre and in the circus then in the grain fields and vineyards. ...the vintage we store comes in ships from the islands of Cos and Chios.'.

    Colummella was born in Spain (in the first century, AD) but found his way to the Roman army. He owned farms in the general vicinity of Rome and wrote a treatise on agriculture: 'de Rustica'. The book was written in twelve books plus one on trees, and includes how to run a farm from the practical point of view as well as the propagation and care of the crops or vines and trees in the field. Practical sections from animals and bee keeping, veterinary concerns, to fish ponds and gardening calendars. Colummella, clearly a mathematician at heart, goes into great detail as to how to calculate how much land you have - areas of squares, triangles, or whatever the field is, and how to calculate the number of vines that are required to fill the field. Also of interest is his discussion on the duties of the overseer, and the overseer's wife where he describes the ways to make wine and preserve or pickle foods.

    Of course the most famous Romans, the Pliny's contributed a wealth of information to science and knowledge through their texts and letters. The Elder Pliny was the uncle of the younger one, and died in the Vesuvius Eruptian, apparently whilst still studying the event.

    The Elder Pliny wrote a comprehensive Natural History of the know world, much of which is still valuable today. From mineralogy, anthropology, geography, horticulture and agriculture, and more - he covered them all in great detail. He was very aware of the differences between regions and how that effected the plants and how people used them. In his discussions of wines, he comments that:

    Democritus, who professed to know all the different kinds of vines in Greece, was alone in thinking it possible for them to be counted, but all other writers have stated that there is a countless and infinite number of varieties; and the truth of this will appear more clearly if we consider the various kind of wines....inasmuch as there are almost as many wines as there are districtsÂ.

    When discussing garden plants and their uses though, the era that he lived in still comes through. Mallow leaves, Âwhen taken in water, ... they keep serpents away as well as Âheal the stings of bees, wasps and hornets.Â.

    The letters of the younger Pliny, are both to him and from him, and concern all aspects of the life in the Empire. As a lawyer he wants justice for everyone and in his letters he appeals to the Emperor for help with various matters. He asks for a firefighting force for one town, that lost many houses and two public building to fire, in a town where there was not a bucket to be found. He mentions that a soothsayer has advised him to rebuild a temple to Ceres, so could Mustus please organize to have four marble columns sent and marble for the floor and walls, too. He discusses the problems of hail at his Tuscany property that will leave just one other property to yield income, the pros and cons of buying a property that is adjacent to one of his own, where the Ânatural fertility is being exausted by poor cultivation . Details of his Tuscany home include Â

    Â...a terrace laid out with box hedges clipped into different shapes, from which a bank slopes down, also with figures of animals cut out of box facing each other on either sideÂ.

    He also give two letters that describe in detail the circumstances of his uncles death, when he went off to study the Vesuvius during its eruptions. The strange darkness, ash falling, and the change in the landscape when the feeble sun reappeared Âbut yellowish as it is during an eclipseÂ.

    To finish the list, there was a monk, Francesco Colonna, in the middle ages (around 1450) who authored a manuscript called Hypnerotomachia Poliphili (The Strive of Love in a Dream). Whilst the general theme of the book is that of trying to define or find love, the action runs parallel to the authors passion about architecture and garden design. Thus all the scenes are meticulously described. In describing a knot garden that he comes across:

    'It had four-sided lineament of knot work three palms wide, very neatly made out of bunches of flowers. The outermost band bent round to make a circle at its midpoint; the bands met as they came from the two corners and circled over one another. The resulting loop was knotted round a second band, four feet inside the first one, and the part of the circle that was above went below the other band, so that the two bands wove alternately above and below each other. And this second four-sided band made loops at its corners in which the knots were arranged with the bands going alternately over, then under....'

    Fortunately the book contain woodcuts which also show the designs, one of which is the knot described above.

    Hopefully this brief introduction to the classic horticultural writers will encourage you to search them out and enjoy the their works.

    There are many available publications that discuss the above authors. Notably Penguin Classics. However, many of these publications are a modern interpretation of the originals. To really get the feel for the tone of the authors, it is worth searching out true translations. Loeb Classical Library (Harvard University) has not only provided excellent translations of the original Greek/Latin but they provide the script on one side with the translation on the facing page, so that those who are Latin/Greek scholars, can double check the facts.

    The above excerpts are:
    From the Loeb library collection:
    Theophrastus : Enquiry into Plants; translated by Arthur Hort.
    Cato and Varro: On Agricuture; translated by W. D. Hooper and H. R. Ash.
    Columella: On Agriculture; translated by E. S. Forster and Edward H Heffner
    Pliny: Natural History; translated by H. Rackham and W. H. S. Jones.
    Pliny: Letters & Panegyricus; translated by Betty Radice.

    The Epic of Gilgamesh: translated by Maureen Gallery Kovacs, Pub: Standford University Press;.
    The Odyssey, Homer: translated and edited by Albert Cook; Pub: W W Norton and Co, A Norton Critical Edition.
    Hypnerotomachia Poliphili, Francesco Colonna: .Translated by Joscelyn Godwin, Pub: Thames & Hudson.

  • John_D
    Original Author
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Nice story. You certainly know garden history.

  • springcherry
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    From Book 5 of Milton's "Paradise Lost"

    On to thir mornings rural work they haste
    Among sweet dewes and flours; where any row
    Of Fruit-trees overwoodie reachd too farr
    Thir pamperd boughes, and needed hands to check
    Fruitless imbraces: or they led the Vine
    To wed her Elm; she spous'd about him twines
    Her mariageable arms, and with her brings
    Her dowr th' adopted Clusters, to adorn
    His barren leaves

    ...

    and now is come
    Into the blissful field, through Groves of Myrrhe,
    And flouring Odours, Cassia, Nard, and Balme;
    A Wilderness of sweets; for Nature here
    Wantond as in her prime, and plaid at will
    Her Virgin Fancies, pouring forth more sweet,
    Wilde above rule or art; enormous bliss.

    ...

    All seasons, ripe for use hangs on the stalk;
    Save what by frugal storing firmness gains
    To nourish, and superfluous moist consumes:
    But I will haste and from each bough and break,
    Each Plant & juciest Gourd will pluck such choice
    To entertain our Angel guest

    ...

    There's much more, of course. What's interesting is that the idea of romantic or non-formal gardening may well have been inspired in the minds of Pope and Walpole by "Paradise Lost" -- giving birth to English Gardening, as we now know it, right here on earth.

    Springcherry

  • katycopsey
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    What's interesting is that the idea of romantic or non-formal gardening may well have been inspired in the minds of Pope and Walpole by "Paradise Lost" -- giving birth to English Gardening, as we now know it, right here on earth.

    Springcherry
    I think the argument goes back much further than that. The Chinese rearranged landscapes into what they thought was a 'natural' image; and the argument of landcape vs 'butchery to plants' is a long standing one that we may never come to terms with - some like it others abhor it, but the points on both sides are fun to read.

  • John_D
    Original Author
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I bet we'll find a lot of good and literary garden writing once we start digging diligently.

  • shadowgarden
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    John, you might want to look at Remarkable Trees of the World, by Pakenham. He classes different trees as Gods, Goddesses, Shrines, Dreams etc. Also I saw a PBS special a while ago about looking for the garden of Eden. I don't remember the exact title. I could give you some short impressions of The giant Cedars in Taiwan which are considered Forest Protective Spirits but I'm not sure if this is what you mean. This is actual not mythical unless you disbelieve in Forest Spirits!

  • John_D
    Original Author
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Forest Spirits sound fascinating.

  • landscaping
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Hello, John,

    The link below will take you to an introductory piece I did on a fantasy landscape described in one of Edgar Allan Poe's works.

    -- David Beaulieu

  • springcherry
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    What an interesting story by Poe. Its an extrodinary thing to be a writer in some ways; you can stack the deck any way you like and then deal out the cards accordingly. A writer gets to be poet, painter, architect, landscaper, designer, choreographer, composer, filmaker and, well, subcreating god, of an imaginative universe. How they then work with that responsibility is soul-defining, since the impact of the work is not on imaginary beings but on actual human beings -- the writer therefore becoming answerable for that impact to that which created those human beings.

    I do like Poe's dig at Addison. There must be few things more galling to a true artist(and yes, even in these postmodern times I believe there are such creatures) as the constant triumph of the ambitious mediocre. Some things never do change.

    Poe personifies himself in Ellison, right?

    Springcherry

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