As a child I wanted to be a stand-up comedian. This didn't happen so I settled for garden speaker. Even when I give a presentation on a subject like Edible Landscaping people laugh. some of the better garden speakers are the late J.C. Raulston, Tony Avent, and some local talents you've never heard of like Denise Smith. I just spoke at a Master Gardener conference on the same program with Felder Rushing. According to the evaluation responses we both got equally high marks. (I can provide a copy of the evaluation report for anyone interested). Yhing is, he gets paid 4 figures and I get 3. How do I get my gigs? I have one seminar where I am asked to speak almost every year but that's only one. I looked at my calendar and I had 16 speaking engagements this year. About half of those were local volunteer engagements where I didn't get paid. Some paid adequate and two paid extremely well. I usually rely on word of mouth but that can take a lifetime it seems. I think I need a plan to market myself for the speakers circuit. I do already have one speaking engagement lined up for 2005. Maybe I am falling below the average? By the way, I had my picture taken with P. Allen Smith at the Garden Writers convention in Chicago. He is a very nice and mannerly person. Paul, you did 80 talks last year and you're asking me for advice? Here is something for everyone to think about: Tony Avent once told JC Raulston that he was hurting the rest of the garden speakers. JC said "How?" Tony replied "JC, why would anybody hire me at my asking price when they can get you for half that amount?" JC immediately went up on his prices. (Same thing might also apply for articles)

Maybe I should persue speaking more, but have only taken a couple of invitations.

One was at the Portland Yard, Garden and Patio Show in 2003. I submitted my name and topic - Pruning.

Another was from leaving my business card after speaking on a radio show as a representative from the Oregon landscape contractors board. I was called by the host, again, and asked to speak about pruning.

Periodic speaking is more my style.

TV and radio seem to allow less control than live group settings. On the air, even the host was under constraints.

I absolutely abhor it.

The mere thought of public speaking sends me to the medicine cabinet for a tranquilizer.. or the bar for a double... no make that a triple.

I've tried to overcome my fear by meeting it head on, but to no avail.
Even when I taught at the Marin Gardening School it was shear pugatory....nope, nada,, never again.

The last time I did an HGTV show I ended up looking like a Geisha Girl by the end of the segment.
They had to powder my face with pancake powder just to keep the red glow from distracting the audience. You think Lantana Radiation Red is bright.... well it's dull dirty russet in comparision to me !

I'm Ok one on one or even a very small group, but not infront of a crowd and definitely not infront of a movie camera.

You couldn't pay me enough.

I did 80 talks last year as part of my job as Extension Horticulturist.

I am interested in talking outside of my county for a little additional $$ and a chance to travel a bit.

I know that finding good speakers is tough for many organizations. I don't know of a referal service or anything other than the Garden Writers. I guess you just have to get a few and let word of mouth do the work for you.

I remember being nervous, now I only get nervous when certain people are in the audience. You know them... the 91 year old gardener who has grown everything you have. At least twice. Now she is enough to rattle a few nerves loose. Of course she is also the nicest person you have ever met and always acts like she learned something. Maybe she did, or maybe you can at least remind her of something she used to know:)

Eddie, I am going to have to find a way to get you to Oklahoma. The Oklahoma Garden Festival has asked if I would work on the speakers committee next year. I may just have to take them up on that. (I am chair of the youth division again this year).

You are right there are many constraint on radio and tv. The first show I do is one hour by myself that is carried across most of the state. I have basically complete control and talk about topics. The second show is a Q&A two hour show. There aren't really any topics except the qestions. I like both formats. the q&a doesn't really have any specific prep time.

Paul

Maybe I should have written my other post a mite bit different.

Its horticulture and pruning that I've done speaking for on two occassions. I've been speaking to small and medium groups on many occassions for over 15 years on non-hort material.

I am fairly unintimidated. Give me one or a stadium full and I can get outside of myself and outside the box. As one mentor wrote about me - "memorable occassions."

For a "fave" sized group. I think I'd like college class size groups on an infrequent basis the most. The group itself lends variety. Its small enough to deal with questions and opinions. And its easy to coordinate.

I don't like to get locked-in to commitments that are marriage-like. That may be why I never became a golf course superintendent, nor a lawn service provider. Landscape design and tree care are versatile and flexible.

Hopefully I have enough energy to make up for reduced vocubulary. I prefer to say "think about" or "consider" rather than "ruminate" so that 100% of a group remains focused.

I've done several talks this year....some informal and a few by invitation. I'm scheduled to teach/lecture at Hofstra this month.

I sometimes speak in the garden, sometimes I even yell. The garden is the best place for yelling. Yelling in the house is a no no especially if the yell contains some bad words. If you are a garden speaker I suggest that you don't actually address what you are saying to the plants, some people will say you are nuts. If you just keep your head down and mumble this looks fairly normal for a gardener.

I never thought of it that way. I don't let people see me talking in the garden as there seems to be some sort of stigma attached to this practice but I notice that I do whistle and sing when I am happy. I talk to my computer sometimes but mostly in expletive deletives. I am relieved that I don't have a speaking engagement until January when I will demonstrate pruning techniques and equipment. Then it will be late April before I speak again unless some local club calls and needs to fill their calendar. I would rather speak in front of a large crowd than a small one and I don't mind being first on a program. Do others have their own preferences?

I'm a Master Gardener, and I just gave my first 2 talks this year on cutting gardens. I loved it! I get quite a rush being up in front of people. Plus, the audience is looking at the slides more than they are at me.
As a MG, my time is volunteer, so no speaking fees, unfortunately.

I'm a writer, not a speaker, and I've finally learned to put my foot down. No more speaking engagements, unless they are to very small groups.

LuvMyDucks, I am a Master Gardener too and after 20 years and a promotion to Lifetime Master Gardener I must say that quite a while back I decided I do enough volunteer hours in various projects but speaking and writing are different : I have heard it said that "why should a newspaper pay a writer for an article when they can get someone at the Extension Service to write something for free?" The same goes for speaking, why pay a decent fee to someone when you can get a Master Gardener to do it for free? Do they get what they pay for? It is a great way to start and to gain experience but at some point you may want to consider charging for your time, not to mention your supplies, your slides, developing them, transportation, etcetera. You may remain a Master Gardener for the rest of your life but surely you don't intend to go that long and never charge what you're worth. You are a Master Gardener, NOT a slave for life. Hope I don't sound too harsh here but as a member of the Garden Writers Association the subject has been mentioned that free speakers and writers hurt those who must make their income from these things. Again, this is not meant as a personal affront but I am just offering you something to think about and maybe down the road.... who knows?

Eddie:
Not only that, but free speakers and writers also lower the status of writers in the estimation of the public, as in "how can [s]he be good if [s]he comes free.

Excellent points Eddie & John. There is certainly nothing wrong with, at minimum, recouping your expenses -- and you should once you progress beyond the raw beginner stage. In polite terms, it isn't called a fee but rather an honorarium.

Over the years, I have witnessed many of the good MG speakers get taken advantage of. Some of them acquire name recognition in their area and then, because they are free, they are EXPECTED to bow to every boneheaded demand made upon them. It almost becomes a situation where the MG owes something or can be made a personal whipping boy upon public demand. (Of course, a few of them ought to be whipped in public but that is another story.)

IronBelly

I find that speaking and consulting not only provide much-needed income, but both give me feed-back and inspiration for my writing as well. By the same token, when I have an article or book published, I get speaking dates as a result.

I book many speaking gigs through an ad I place in the Federated Garden Club magazine in my state. I usually book six or seven talks as a result, so its well worth the cost of the ad.

The Massachusetts chapter of the Federated Garden Clubs also have a Âspeakers day for the garden club program chairs speakers come and give a five minute sample of what they do, and we pass out our info after the meeting. There are garden speakers, flower arrangers and others who present programs to garden clubs, and this arrangement is beneficial to the program chairs and the speakers. I book at least 15 talks a season from this meeting alone.

I also book speaking dates from people who visit my website, the garden writers site, and the commercial listings here on GardenWeb.

A good speaker provides a balance of entertainment, information and inspiration, and a great speaker is also a good storyteller.
C.L. Fornari

Well put C.L. ,

I have spoke on landscape topics only a few times at work and taught several groups in the field ... all in alll I found it lots of fun ... I also do quite a bit of photography .... if I do speak again I will keep in mind your tips they make a lot of sense.

Good Day ......

Hi,

I've read with interest this thread because I've utilized several people from this site as speakers for programs. I volunteer as Program/Speaker Chairman for two local nonprofit organizations, one being a flower and garden show. I do have a couple of questions though. What is considered a normal speaker fee? While I do feel that speakers costs should be reimbursed, I do question those who charge fees in the thousands of dollar ranges (you know who you are!) My question is do you really think that you should be commanding those types of fees just because you have written a book(s). Some of you are excellent writers and should continue in that aspect, because some are boring and unorganized as public speakers. Should the speaker fee be different when you come and hock your books? Do you do any gratis, or reduced fees for non profit organizations? Shouldn't writers consider doing programs as a means for promoting their books, rather than charging those high fees and hocking their books. I would think that writers would want to market their books, and that they would jump at the opportunity to do so, and being a speaker would help in doing this. However, some want to promote their books, sell their books to the group, and charge high speaker fees in addition.

I contacted one highly respected and popular writer who frequently responds on this forum to do a program and was told "Time is money and my time is expensive!" That author wanted speaker fees in the thousand dollar range for a program lasting 45 minutes to an hour. What could anybody tell you in that time frame worth that amount of money on gardening? For that amount of money I'd at least want some good stock tips! I also notice that this person is silent on this forum about what his speaker fees are.

I've also had authors who only told us what we could have read in their books, complete with all slides and pictures from their books. That was an author who charged $2,500.00 for a program plus travel expenses and perks. Is that cost really justifiable, because for that price it would be cheaper for me to buy copies of his books and pass them out at a meeting...

Perhaps some who quote high fees do so in order NOT to be be asked to do programs- kinda like a nusiance fee. Perhaps it may be an ego thing- now that I'm published, I'm hot stuff, and need to charge high fees to justify my importance.

Please don't get me wrong, I think that all speakers should be justly compensated for doing programs. It takes a lot of time and effort to put together programs, especially if you use your own material and photos. I guess my question is what standard, or yardstick, do you use as the basis that you base your fees on? Is it because you are published? Is it because you've been asked to give programs to important organizations. Is it because you see a difference to giving a program to gardeners, rather that say a horticultural organization, or at a flower and garden show where you were on the bill with someone prominent? I've also been told by some speakers that their fee is based on the expected audience number, or the type of group.

TV and radio gardening hosts/personalities are a group I find who ask high speaker fees.Some I just watch their programs just to see what wrong info they pass out. When and where did Martha S. have time to become a gardening expert? Some of her info is "not a good thing".

Locally, we have a garden writer who just retired. He should have done so at least ten years ago, because that's about how long he hasn't had an inkling on what's going on locally concerning gardening. All of his articles quotes a local horticulture professor or botanical garden representative in the form of "Well, I discussed your problem with Dr. ****, and she says, or recommends..." Yet, he's supposed to be the local resident authority, and has written a book about garden in the area... Fortunately, he's a better speaker!

Anyway, just thought that I'd throw these comments your way from a different prospective and provide comments to fuel this discussion!

Bill

Yes, as one who has a limited program budget, I do want to get the best, most interesting, but least expensive speakers. I also look for interesting speakers and interesting topics. I usually don't get humorous speakers and topics, because my group is more interested in the meat and potatoes of gardening.

But Bill, what is wrong with mixing humor with information? I give a Yard Art program that is strictly entertainment and feel it is a welcome diversion to the audience (not necessarily the program chairman) from some of the other topics that can sometimes be a bit dry or seem like an advertisement for ones plants or products. The Edible Landscaping program I give is incredibly funny, odd as that may sound, and I base the entire format of my website on that concept - Information mixed with humor.
What would one charge? I agree that some get outrageous fees. The Georgia State Master Gardeners paid me $100 plus waived my vendors fee but paid Felder Rushing $1000 plus expenses. He made that much more selling 5 cartons of his books. I am not saying I am the same calibre speaker as Felder but I was ranked higher in the response results that were sent to me. If you ask each of us what would be a decent fee you would probably get a different answer from each of us. A couple of places where you might check on speakers fees by clicking on Speakers Bureau are: www.gwaa.org and www.georgiaperennial.org. My sister is an excellent and entertaining speaker on crafts such as making greeting cards with laminated wildflowers. She was tickled to death when I arranged for the Master Gardeners to pay her $75. She had never been paid that much before. I couldn't agree with you more about Martha. She recommends play sand as a soil amendment instead of construction grade sand, she recommends crushing the stem of plants for arrangements, she recommends bone meal when superphosphate would be better. I don't think she writes her own material on gardening topics and I think this material is outdated.
I think your post was well put and brought up some interesting questions about speakers fees. I am so glad this topic came up because I have an engagement coming up in the next state over but drivable distance and I will soon have to set a fee. I have two speaking engagements arranged for 2005 but the fee has not been set yet. I don't mind public speaking but I do dread negotiating. I wish the party contacting me would make the first offer. Wonder how others feel about that?

Eddie:
It sounds like you need an agent. (But don't ask me how to snatch one, since I've never employed one.)

This is great information.

Eddie - you already have talks set for 2005? Im impressed, i thought I was scheduling out there for next December. Congrats on the retirement!

Fees - I think it depends on the audience and the setting. The speakers can be a real draw for a garden show. This helps sell tickets which raises money for the event. A garden club or Master Gardener group generally isn't raising money, at least not much. I think it is important to support the people who have supported you. I give a discount to Master Gardener groups and would discuss fees with any non-profit.

I also think it depends on how far you have to travel. It may only be a 45 min talk, but if you have to fly/drive multiple hours and stay over night the fee should be higher.

Do any of you have video or tapes to send to interested people? I hate hiring a big name and finding out that they really don't speak well. It is amazing what sneaks by out there.

Eddie, we both need to get books published so we have a wider audience. I will negotiate for you if you negotiate for me:)

Paul

Posted by: Eddie_GA_7A on Tue, Dec 30, 03 at 2:16:

>>>I don't mind public speaking but I do dread negotiating. I wish the party contacting me would make the first offer. Wonder how others feel about that?Hi, Eddie ~

What about asking your sister to be your "agent"? Refer all queries to her, saying that "Ms./Mrs. so-and-so" handles all your speaking engagements. Then you and she can discuss each situation before she responds/gets back to the organization/club with the expected honorarium, mileage, other requirements***, etc.

Maybe you can even have a form/questionnaire for the club/organization to fill out and return to her (who is/are sponsor/s, what is budget, are they charging admission, is event open to public, who is contact person, how many expected in case you have hand-outs, slide projector available, etc.) Sometimes a garden club "district" gets together to sponsor a speaker. Since there are several clubs involved, the budget may be larger, and therefore the honorarium....

You could do the same for your sister. She could say that you are her agent for her speaking engagements.

(***I now ask that the room/hall where I'm speaking have shades or that, at least, it can be darkened. One of the worst experiences in my life was having the hall windows look out on a beautiful harbor on a VERY sunny day. My slides could not be seen because there were no shades to darken the room. The ladies had just enjoyed a huge lunch. The sun was in their eyes. You know the rest...LOL.
At least when it's dark I don't know how many are asleep.)

Of course, as we were told in Chicago, the future is in PowerPoint (sp?). This may be the beginning of the end for me....

Happy New Year!

This is turning out to be a great thread. I think I will take CL Fornari's advice and run an ad in the Federated Garden Club publication. I would like to see a sample of her ad plus I would like to know where she appears in the commercial area of this GardenWeb? Paul, thanks for the encouragement. I know it is scary when you pay your money and take your chances. The Garden Writers Association requires any potential speakers to name at least 2 GWA members who can vouch for their ability as a speaker. Dear Boston, the idea of having someone else pose as agent/middleman has occoured to me.
The form is something I hadn't thought of. About that lack of shades, the people who hired you should have covered that issue, shame on them. What I hate is the people who try to sucker me into speaking for free and I'm learning to keep my guard up against that. These same people also want you to bring your own projector and screen plus provide handouts and donate a doorprize. I have been taken advantage most by a little local garden club I belong to which, by the way, has plenty of budget. We need others to weigh in here.

I speak in Florida and neighboring states in the Coastal South. My topics are numerous and cover many gardening subjects as well as floral design. I am author of a book about gardening in the Coastal South---as a matter of fact, that's the title. I think we have to do our homework and pay our dues on the speakers' circuit. We have to start somewhere. I've been speaking (100 mile range) locally for a couple of years now---mostly for free and for the privilege of selling my book. I find that if they let me talk, the book will sell. Some of my engagements are still gratis, but I am beginning to get some invitations to places that are willing to pay an honorarium and put me up--feed me, etc. Sure does feel good to be appreciated and not just taken for granted. Everyone knows who gives programs of this kind that it is not free--especially when you do your own slides-- have your own projector-- do your own handouts--not to mention the time involved. If I did this for a living I'd be hungry. Maybe the new year will bring fame and fortune!
I have enjoyed this part of the forum. Reading about others' experiences has been revealing. Thanks.

Earlier in this thread there was a comment, "the future is in PowerPoint". I am just a little taken back by this statement. I had thought this was a foregone conclusion from long ago.

In one local certificate program I am involved in, we bring in lots of experts as instructors (and pay them well). We encourage them to just show up with a CD in their pocket containing their entire program. We provide the laptop and LCD projector. Slides are a PITA.

PowerPoint adds polish and pizzazz to any program. More importantly it offers convenience and flexibility to the speaker. The program is quite intuitive and can be tailored to suit the needs of your audience. Although content is always important, PowerPoint will improve most any presentation -- the product is just that good.

Any more, if I can't use PowerPoint, I won't accept that engagement.

IronBelly

Eddie asked where I advertise its in Garden Webs Garden Bazaar section, under Education.

Ive gotten several contacts from this listing, and consider it worth the price. I think that its important to have as many avenues to your door as possible, and this is one!

C.L. Fornari

>>Eddie asked where I advertise its in Garden Webs Garden Bazaar section, under Education. Hi, C.L.~ Had not been aware of that section. Thanks!

>>Earlier in this thread there was a comment, "the future is in PowerPoint". I am just a little taken back by this statement.I had thought this was a foregone conclusion from long ago...Hi, IronBelly ~

You obviously are very knowledgeable about state-of-the-art computer technology. I'm an old lady (who *still* has problems with her VCR) and knew nothing about computers when I was hired by AOL about 8 years ago to write a garden column (I was writing for newspapers and magazines). They (Digital City Boston) wanted "content." I told them I could type, but had no computer--only a word processor. My 33-year-old son said "Mom, you can do it!" If it weren't for him, I would never have dared to even try (using one of his old computers).

Little by little he teaches me when he has the time; I e-mail him when I have questions; and occasionally, I'm able to bribe him to "come over" by offering him a home-cooked meal. He has bought me several computers now, and three digital cameras (keeps upgrading). This Christmas I said "No more! Please." (LOL) -- I'm still learning to use what I have. I'm amazed at how much he has taught me, however, and how he has helped me develop a Web site.

Regarding speaking engagements and my slides, I have thousands of them -- about 35-40 years' worth. At the last Garden Writers convention in Chicago there were excellent programs on PowerPoint and photography. One fact was clear: either you re-format the slides (not sure if that is correct term), or you take new images with a digital camera. (One of the speakers said he hired "a kid" at $12/hour to do the transferring work.)

SO..... for now at least, I'm stuck with my slides (LOL). There are many gardens I will probably never visit again to re-photograph (in Russia, Morocco, Zimbabwe, Botswana, Hawaii, etc.) Just at the Garden Writers conventions/regional meetings in various locations throughout the U.S., I've taken at least a thousand slides per meeting.

My hope is that by the time no one uses slides anymore, my grandson will help me out (LOL). The question is, "What will I have that I can bribe him with?"

Speaking of images, I have some good ones of Eddie and C.L. that I took in Chicago. Can't remember if they were slides or digital, though.

Pictures of me and JC? And what were we doing? Networking? My daughter loaded PowerPoint on my computer and I made two slide shows, one for the Cullowhee Native Plant Conferences and one of all the past Garden Writers conventions I have attended. The problem is, almost no one can open these programs so I can't have my webmaster install them on my web site. I am in a quandry as to how to fix this. iMac has its own slide program but is there any way I can move the PP slides en masse? Then my Zio won't download my digital pictures. Technology, I love/hate it.

Did you ever have a good presentation just go down the drain? Sometimes, in spite of your best efforts and thorough preparation, disaster strikes.

A few years ago, when the Internet was just beginning to really roll, I gave a class titled, "Gardening On the Internet". It was held in the computer lab of a local college and had a great computer lab. The facilities were wonderful with many independent stations and huge monitors which made it perfect for several students to work together at any station.

I made arrangements with the professor and even did a dry run several days before class to get familiar with the facilities. I was prepared! In addition, I was assured by the professor that he would be just outside the lab in his office should any questions come up.

I was really pumped and eager. I arrived at the computer lab about an hour and a half early just to make sure everything was ready and maybe run through my presentation just one more time before class began. Strangely, the doors were all locked. Hmm... The professor was nowhere to be found. The janitor assured me that the professor was ALWAYS there -- maybe just out to lunch. The clock was ticking and I began to make some phone calls ... then more phone calls. Time seemed to be flying by. I FINALLY got a hold of the professor by phone. He regretfully told me that he had just had a death in the family and was leaving town -- as I was peering out the window watching several more students show up for class.

I was finally able to convince a janitor that the frantic madman he was talking to was supposed to be allowed into the computer lab. I turned on the lights and assured my bewildered students that all was fine. Of course, that was BEFORE I realized that the computer system that the good professor assured me would be up and running was locked out with a password. By some fate of the gods, one of the college students sauntered into the room hoping to use the facilities. Remembering the devious nature of college students (like I used to be), I asked this guy if he might just, by any slim chance, happen to know the password? By curiously cocking his head with that giveaway twinkle in his eye he said he "would see what he could do". BINGO! Not wasting a single keystroke, he broke into the system as I stuffed a ten dollar bill into his pocket and told him I knew nothing.

Class was actually proceeding pretty well ... that is until I realized that two of the stations didn't work. My savior with the password was still on site, working in a room adjoining the lab. I asked him if he knew anything about the two stations that didn't work -- they worked fine just two days ago when I checked everything out.

"Oh, yeah. Those two stations blew-out their mother boards today." reported my hacking savior. Thank God that class finally ended!

IronBelly

This is a great thread. Just a couple thoughts.

First, on fees: This is a tough one. I think that for most authors, their fee goes up as they find they need the gigs less and less. In other words, I might fly down to LA to give a talk for $500 if I'm hungry for the work, but if my schedule is crowded and I'm not all that eager, I might charge $1000+, which means I'll do fewer talks, but that's OK.

Second, I could not resist passing on this article in Wired Magazine about the evils of Power Point. As writers who often express complex and more poetic thoughts that would otherwise fit in a Power Point outline, I think this is an interesting & important issue.

Thanks for posting this.

I particularly like this paragraph (which should be printed on every box Power Point comes in):

"Presentations largely stand or fall on the quality, relevance, and integrity of the content. If your numbers are boring, then you've got the wrong numbers. If your words or images are not on point, making them dance in color won't make them relevant. Audience boredom is usually a content failure, not a decoration failure."