16,949 Garden Web Discussions | Growing Tomatoes

@ Plaidbird - yes the inner city garden is full of its own challenges - I have spent the last three years turning the narrow lot next to my house into a productive garden and usable outdoor space - I am lucky I purchased it when I did because it would have a house on it now If I did not. its not easy but it is rewarding. I am going to loose some sun this year to new construction too. Part of the problem is not having workable soil and part of the problem is trying to cram too many things into a small space conditions are never ideal.

Incidentally this morning I turned over the offending container to open up some draining and it was very dry - even at the bottom - I cut out the fabric enlarged the holes and watered - and water actually came out of the bottom this time - I think the problem has been the fabric no more of that stuff in that application - and perlite for vermiculite in the future -

I only container grow for the most part and use the 5-1-1 mix that you will find on the container growing forum and the link was given to you. The other option is to use something like Promix BX or HP, whichever is available to you. However, you need to add a slow release fertilizer and then fertilize with a weak dose every few days. Drainage is important with containers growing. I agree with all of the above, ditch the landscape fabric in the future.
Good luck!

Looks normal, atleast to me!

fruitee

I did transplants, not direct seeds. Started my cukes and squash indoors. The squash just exploded as soon as they got in the ground. Cukes were a bit slower but very quickly grew. Beans I direct seeded. I have raised beds, don't have any plastic or mulch. I worked in some fertilizer when I prepped the beds in the spring, did one liquid feed a month or so ago... The tomatoes I'd started were in 1 gallon nursery pots when I was able to plant them out. I started them in March.

I'm growing the toms this year SFG style, so I have them pruned to 1-2 stems and have each in 1sf. They've been doing quite well, though I am noticing some blossom drop on the brandywine and cherokee purple.

Ah, so the tomatoes were pretty big (flowers?) when you planted them out. Mine weren't started that much later, but were in 4" pots as transplants so were maybe 6" tall, some may have been 8-10" but I planted deep.

No time today, but I will post pix on the picture thread this weekend. They're growing very thick stems, lots of leaves (had to take some lower leaves off when weaving yesterday). Took flowers off a few that had them (1 Gardner's Delight I planted yesterday actually had a small fruit).

I've got pretty good soil in most of my beds so I planted the peppers app. 15" apart, indeterminates 20-24", and determinates in 1 side bed (experiment) 12" apart. But that's in 8" of composted manure. The last 19 I threw in yesterday are also in compost (leaves and kitchen scraps) but 2ft apart since the bed's not very wide.

>Of all the "how to prune a tomato" articles on the web, that is probably the worst one I've seen.

I agree! And the goofy cartoon pictures donâÂÂt help. They donâÂÂt even show what a real sucker looks like. The cartoonist obviously didn't know how to illustrate the text - which is unclear and confusing on it's own.

Is the utube video the same one with the guy with the sick, tomatoes ? The ones he cleaned up but forgot the ones in the background. Then says he did all this on purpose. I'm not going there.

This seems to be the tomato version of being Rick Rolled.
Too funny. :D

p.s. If you don't know what Rick Rolled means, just go Google.

As has been pointed out to you before, determinate tomato varieties are not perennials.
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No sir> All tomatoes belong to the same genus:

As It has been pointed out to you and do it again. (from wikipedia)

>>>The tomato is the edible, often red fruit/berry of the nightshade Solanum lycopersicum,[1][2] commonly known as a tomato plant >>>The tomato belongs to the nightshade family, Solanaceae.[1][3] The plants typically grow to 1�"3 meters (3�"10 ft) in height and have a weak stem that often sprawls over the ground and vines over other plants. It is a perennial in its native habitat NOTE: There is no distinction is made amongst the varieties.

It is true that in the non tropics tomatoes are grown as annual but fundamentally they are PERENNIAL. This is the same about all varieties. At any rate, either all tomatoes are annual or perennial. No exception in the fundamental genus.

The terms "determinant" and "indeterminant" come from statistical structure, loosely applied to tomatoes. The terms have much wider application in mathematics In tomato it just refers to the growth habit and FORM/STRUCTURE and its predictability.

FINALLY:

To claim that Determinant tomato plants just drop dead toward the end of season (supposedly implying that the indets live on) is just no accurate. And I am referring to the statement that I quoted. I do not know who wrote it. So this is not a personal issue with you or anybody else.

There are some dets that do produce all season, but not many of them do so.

From a biologic/botonic point of view the two, ind and det, are defined by the internode distances between branches that give rise to blossoms and fruits.

I'm always foregtting those internode distances, I'm not perfect yet, ahem,but I think it's something like 2-3 for dets and 3-4 for indet.

So yes, our garden tomatoes are all in the genus Solanum and species esculentum ( some use lycopersicum), the currant ones that many grow being S.Pimpinellifolium, But it was found very uselful to divide them into det and indet based on internode distances which does help gardners, whether commercial orhome gardeners, know how long the vines might be in terms of how they are going to grow their tomatoes.

And yes, sometimes when viewing many sites you'll see some varieties being referred to as semi-deteminates or even semi-ind, don't ask. LOL

Carolyn

Eventually the weight of the fruit will pull the stems down.

Yeah, eventually it should cascade down by its own weight. But you can provide some guidance.

Carolyn,

We are thinking of two different things : OP wrote:

>>>> the masses consist of thousands of tiny (what looks like insect eggs or mold colonies).Note the description : """ of thousands of tiny ... insect eggs"""slimy inside"""

So based on that description I was thinking of something like this :

As a follow up, yes Carolyn, it looks like you nailed it with the "dog barf" fungus. Thank you all very much for the info. In this case, I am glad to know it is nothing to worry about.

Happy growing all!

In a general way they are all symptomatic of catfacing and classed at that but with some fused fruit (fasciated blooms) and some zippering in this last pic. All are relatively common with early blooms and can affect most any variety. Some research indicates it is more common with potato leaf varieties but is far from exclusive to them.

It is usually a result of cool temps at the time of pollination In some cases the sepals of the bloom may adhere to the fruit and cause them to be deformed, in some cases a second fruit or a partially pollinated ovule (as in the tiny one near the stem in the next to last photo) are incorporated into the dominant fruit causing the deformity. and zippering can be caused by all sorts of damage or injury including all of the above.

But none of them preventable in the usual sense of the word as they are primarily weather related and none are indicative of pests or disease. They are simply classed as physiological damages. The fruits are still edible and later fruit seldom displays the same symptoms.

Your yellow leaves you asked about is another matter. That is mostly nutrient related (based on the photos) and while you will lose the leaves already damaged, since you are feeding them the new growth should be healthy.

Hope this helps.

Dave

Here is a link that might be useful: Physiological, Nutritional, and Other Disorders of Tomato Fruit

Definitely your very first picture depict a defect due to some possible culprits damage. One can see the chewing marks.

In the above two picture also they are not typical catfacing either (IMO) catfacing is normally centered around the blossom point, not on the side or stem end.
This is my understanding of Catfacing. It starts at pollination and shortly after that can be visible. Any crack and/or defect developed later is not a catfacing.

Thanks all. I did some reading and I'm guessing the problem is that I've been overwatering the past few days. I wouldn't have guessed that just a few days would have such a big impact, but earlier fruits did not have this problem and the only change is that I've been watering more often.

I've been kind of winging it on watering up to now. That has worked OK for hot peppers in the past, but I gather maters are more sensitive about such things. I guess I'd better go get some dowels.

The good news is that you caught them quickly, and not when the tomatoes were almost full sized.

Over-watering or abnormally high amounts of rain - a common problem for much of the country this year - is one of the major contributing factors to lack of taste.

Dave

In the link below Tania explains some of the info about this variety that many of us have problems with.

Baker Creek is not the only source of seeds, see link below, but as I recall Solana in Canada does not ship to the US, Diane's Flowers is in the US.

Tania notes that SESE lists it as Black Brandywine, which is wrong, but two folks from SESE in VA will be visiting me on WED and I'll call that to their attention.

Carolyn, who has never eliminated a variety that comes well recommended, or even a new one, if it doesn't perform in one season. Just too many variables associated with weather especially, as Dave noted above.

Here is a link that might be useful: True ??? Black brandywine

(deleted duplicate sorry)

This post was edited by slowjane on Mon, Jun 30, 14 at 13:52

Yes, the infamous microclimates of the LA area....still getting my head around it. I moved a couple miles north a year ago, and I swear the weather is different, because we're over the hill on the valley side of LA now - from Sunset 23 to Sunset 20/21

Sunset Gardening description: "The combination of weather influences described for Zone 20 applies to Zone 21 as well. Your garden can be in ocean air or a high fog one day and in a mass of interior air (perhaps a drying Santa Ana wind from the desert) the next day."

Right now highs are mid 80's and lows are mid 60's, with a whopping 80% humidity that makes me feel like I'm in Massachusetts.

I'm thinking that since my garden is so small - I might pull the plants as they stop producing and put in a new plant. Or even a clone from one I've got now? And perhaps do a second tomato season like Dave suggested.....if I can bring myself to actually pull out one of these plants....

Do folks ever take a cutting and cultivate a clone for a second planting in the same year?