16,949 Garden Web Discussions | Growing Tomatoes

I am also a second year grower. Tried a few different things, made a number of mistakes. Had some plants that produced well and some didn't. It's a learning process for the backyard grower.

Some people here prefer staking, which requires pruning the plants more heavily. I've tried it and decided not to do it since I don't want to bother with regular pruning and it tends to decrease production on a per-plant basis.

This year, I've chosen to make my own cages and let the tomato grow without pruning. Here is a photo of one of them made from 7 foot plastic covered metal garden stakes, bamboo sticks and tree branches fastened together with plastic zip ties.

You'll have to make do this year with some hodge-podge supports for those cage things. But before next year I suggest reading through at least some of the many discussions here on cages and stakes and other methods of support.

You'll quickly discover that the cone ring things are generally considered a waste of money for most tomato plants.

They work great for pepper plants, eggplants and such but for tomatoes, aren't much good as they require additional height and stronger support.

As others have already said you will need to tie them off to a fence or add some sort of outside stake to keep them from falling over. Many of them are already leaning in your photos so work to get them as straight and deep as possible. If you try to put stakes in your containers this late it will only damage the roots.

Dave

It is impossible to identify the tomato because there are so many different commercial red medium fruits out there. Since it just said "Tomato" on the description, most likely it is a hybrid bred for greenhouse production, early pick and/or shipping hardiness. As for the seeds, since there is all manner of ripening techniques and speeds associated with commercial production, the variation in colors is not surprising. You did not mention why you were interested in learning it's identity. If you liked it, save the seeds and plant out next year, with low expectations of the results. If it is a hybrid, you probably won't get anything like the parent, and germination rates for manipulated ripened tomatoes is going to be low.

Agree. We get at least 1 "ID this tomato" request per week and the answer is always the same. It is not possible to do. Even holding the tomato in hand and eating it would still be impossible. DNA testing might narrow it down to 50 possibilities, maybe.

slightly flat, average size being 2.5-3" diameter to 1.5-2" height. Bottom of the tomato has a slight central depression. The tomatoes are very meaty, sweet, and do not have many seeds. The seeds seem to have a small black spot near the pointy end

That describes over a thousand varieties if not more. The fruit was harvested immature for shipping so the seeds are likely not mature and may have been damaged by the artificial ripening process used.

Dave

Am wondering how those requirements change in regards to climate. I can get plants to 7 feet growth but it would be to detriment of production, our summer generally coolish in June and what I get in Sept is a bonus already so couple of flashes indeterminates and we are done. I think spacing and pruning has to be determined on case by case basis with just general suggestions kept in mind.

OP here. Thanks for all the inputs, everybody. :)

We're definitely Zone 9, smack dab in the center of California's Sacramento Valley. Major agriculture everywhere around me -- almonds, walnuts, olives, rice, livestock feed. We have long, hot summers. Jul-Aug-Sep are daily avg highs in the mid-90s every year.

I'm noticing that my wood cages block a bit of sunlight, so I may have to tear down and re-built next year. Also, I need to prune my Mulberry a bit as it blocks the sun in the afternoon. Most of the sun they get is morning sun.

Next year... maybe with the Tormato support, in buckets, in the front yard.

I've gone ahead and pruned everything I could to single stem. I had to keep a couple as two stem because the second stem was already bigger than a pencil and I didn't want to stunts the plants if not necessary.

Still tons of airspace so far. Most are approaching 18" tall at this point.

Here is a link that might be useful: Avg Weather

yardenman: Thought about it. It's possible they're starving, but they've only been in the potting mix for about 10 days. I guess some other problems could arise from the mix as well, such as acidity and a few other things. My biggest fear is that under and over fertilizing can have similar symptoms....

thewallawallaian89: They've been between 65-80 degrees indoors. Usually in 70-75 range. They shouldn't be complaining too much I hope.

Is it possible to see a photo of them? I don't have any experience with the problem your having, I'd just like to see what it looks like and see what the census ends up being.

If cutworms are what is actually doing the damage rather than something else then yes the stick along the stem works.

Cutworms are a chronic problem for me but the only time I have lost a plant to one is when I have neglected to get the straw or stick in for some reason.

As I said above this is new info but has been common knowledge among farmers and gardeners for over a century if not longer. :) And it is always possible that the small worm you see isn't the one that did the damage.

I know some seem to really push the cardboard tube collars but that assumes the worm can't come up inside the collar or crawl over it.

Dave

I've found that toilet paper tubes placed over the seedling and pressed in slightly always seem to work. Not that other enclosures don't. And I make a 6" hole of good composted soil so I am removing any cutworms from close to it anyway.

I just did the same thing to my plant--I tried to train it, but bent the main stem too far and it came off in my hand, right at the joint. What's this about rooting the tops? How do I do that?

Because I've been very lucky, lazy, and cheap I have collected scads of five gallon buckets. They are very easy to take off and to put over plants, even those of some good size, and they are far sturdier than any other method I've seen for protecting plants from frosts. If the weather gets stormy, rocks or bricks will weigh them down well, and they stack well when not being used. Just a thought.

I have used WOW to get earlier tomatoes for a number of years. I am not talking about a month early, only a couple of weeks at the most. In my experience, there are multiple factors that must be addressed. Here are two: Tomato selection is fundamental. Pick an early small like 4th of July or SunSugar (they do best for me). Regular size or larger typically won't set fruit until the temps are to their liking. The earlies will set in the frost free days of late spring. Second thing is timing. WOW are only about a foot tall when T-P'd, so if your plant outgrows them and you still need the frost protection, it's bye-bye tomato plant.

Seysonn, that is about what I did for years, I plant one of each variety into WOW and then later plant same variety without, so yeah, I do have more robust plant and better- earlier yield with WOW, no questions about it in my experience. Here in Chicago, it is really not the frost that is most damaging, it is bouts of really windy decimating storms that usually happen once or twice in May. Granted there is possibility of low temps but near the lake where I garden it is less of a problem. Another thing that most people agree on, that planting bigger plants does not help and tiny seedlings will establish better. It is true and not so true... i.e. bigger plants will routinely give about one week earlier yields . While it might not be much but it counts for short summer areas.

Better chance of survival by far had it been done several weeks back. At this point survival is doubtful IMO. If you have the time and room and what to see what happens, fine. They won't do anything like that so thin them out substantially and see what happens.

Personally, I'd probably pull and pitch them and use the space for something with assured productivity.

Dave

Looks like you have flowers already. You can taste test some in just a little bit and decide to pull them later if they are yucky. I too would have a hard time pulling such healthy plants :)

Most any source of stress can trigger blooming on a young plants. Being root bound in its container is the most common IME. Ambient air temps that are too warm is another. Inconsistent soil moisture levels another. Pests and over-fertilization another although it doesn't sound as if you have been doing that.

So rather than just removing the blooms you do best to ID the source of the stress and eliminate it.

Dave

Thanks for the replies. My air-temp is in the mid 60's. Don't think they are root bound yet as my containers are 3" square and about same for the depth. I don't let the soil dry out to the point where they wilt (which they have never done) but even though the soil is damp/moist to the touch it isn't like it is after just watering. Only 2 varieties out of my 17 have put out blossoms. Identifying the source could be difficult under the circumstances that I've listed. I guess the next best thing is to just remove the blossoms. I plan on putting them outside to stay around the 2nd week of May which isn't far away. Thanks again for taking the time to try and help me out.

or i could look on the bottom of the pot for a number XD

i meant that i use miraclegro half and half with old soil or garden soil when repotting new plants, unless im planting them in the ground where the soil is good quality.

I think you missed the point missingtheobvious was making above. You never use soil/dirt in any amount or any type in any container. It compacts, drains poorly, retains water far too long and causes root rot and other diseases.

You are just asking for problems with plants if you use anything other than a light soil-less mix in containers.

i dont think the tomato has outgrown the pot yet, because it hasnt grown much since i bought it. and the container it was in originally was much smaller

Top growth is not an indicator of whether a plant is root bound or not. The bottom line is your pot in the photo is far too small. That is obvious by the scale of the plant to the pot. It is too small for for 90% of the tomato plants out there. So transplanting it into a much bigger container after stripping off all the affected leaves and filling the pot with a proper potting mix might save the plant.

Of course if you knew the name of the variety it could make a big difference. Can you go back to HD and find another one of them and note the name?

Dave

Me too ! I'm dreaming of standing in the warm sun, salt shaker in hand and scarfing down !

Congratulations! Enjoy the great eating to come...

Edie

Sorry to hijack a thread, but I think this relates and it would be redundant to start my own thread.

I put my indeterminates too close together. I don't know what I was thinking. I have 4 plants, a foot between each (in a square shape).

I don't want to prune (did research and I'm of the non-pruning opinion) ... but I'm wondering if in my situation I'm going to NEED to prune?

I'm in a dry, dry area so I'm not too worried about rot from lack of airflow. I'm training them up long poles and tying them away from each other. If they weren't already 1+ foot tall I'd just move them.

Did the OP mention anything about production per sq. foot? I don't think so. Sq. foot production may be of interest to you but it isn't of interest to many, if not most, gardeners. Production per plant is.

f it does not appeal to you plant JUST one in 3' x 3" (=9 sf)

I don't know where you are getting your measurements but assuming you mean that 3 feet x 3 feet (not inches) = 9 sq. feet is one spacing option you are right. That is because the average indeterminate tomato plant is at least 3-4' wide.

But you can do the same test using any plant spacing you wish within reason and get the same results.

And yes in a 3' x 6' bed I would probably plant only 3 (not 2) stagger-planted indeterminate varieties, caged and unpruned. And assuming we used the same varieties and provided the same growing conditions I would get 2 to 3x the production in both weight and numbers you will get from 6 plants in that same bed. You might get a few ripe fruit earlier and might get a few that are somewhat larger but your overall production in numbers and total weight will be much less than mine It is simple anatomy of a tomato plant as it grows.

I can say that because I have done it in my own gardens many times. In over 50 years of raising tomatoes I have tried just about everything at least once if not more just to discover for myself what works best. One never knows unless they give it a real try. Otherwise it is just guessing.
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Macer - yes IMO you will need to prune them. A 3-4' wide plant just can't grow well in 1' of space. Personally, even though they are a foot tall I would be tempted to try to transplant a couple of them. Alternative - root cuttings off the center 2 and then snip the mother plants off at ground level and plant the 2 rooted cuttings with better spacing.

Dave