16,949 Garden Web Discussions | Growing Tomatoes
Hi fireduck,
I'm on the sunny side of WA. I grew out four Willamettes last year purchased as starts from a local Spokane nursery. I planted two in pots (5 gal) and two in ground. All were very healthy, vigorous and productive compact plants. Each went thru three distinct fruiting cycles and lasted until frost.
There were a few problems, the biggest being the taste. They tasted on par with store bought tomato, so completely tasteless. Very disappointing.
Also, they were not early either. Anna Russian and CP ripened earlier for me.
On a more positive note, "The Tomato Lady" in Spokane Valley, 10 miles away from me, has had great successes with Willamettes. She won grand prize at the local county fair in 2013 with her Willamette and it's one of her favorites varieties.
Shelley
Wouldn't a cold frame arrangement help raise the early soil temperature past the critical point? Just use it for appropriate non-tomato plants and move it out of the way when the toms are demanding to go into the ground? (caution: even though I do all germination outside, I haven't used a CF since they were made of wood and glass storm windows because plastic wasn't invented yet.) I know there's a scale problem but early toms are worth it!
"Where I am in Miami, Florida, I am wondering if a shade house would ... help tomatoes survive a Miami summer. I believe they are used mostly to help Orchids survive in sunny yards."
My parents' home in WPB had a grapefruit, an old-timey avocado, and an impossibly huge ficus tree. They held what seemed like a hundred orchids and bromeliads 24/7/365. It would seem you guys have an ideal orchid climate.
I'm not familiar with midwest weather Randy but in North Tx I must plant at the very earliest date after frost,plant two weeks early and cover when frost threatens or use cold frames to give plants a head start. The time between last frost and 90 deg F where blossoms no longer set isn't long enough for tomatoes varietes over 70 days. Most people plant two weeks before last frost and cover as needed. The problem with that is if you are delayed in removing covers plants can be shocked or killed from overheating. My answer is in my cold frames. My frames are much taller than conventional. I am both curious and frugal so I repurpous,recycle and experiment at every opertunity. I will explain one frame that you are familiar with so that you can see how I build a frame from scratch. i rescued a supermarket reach in dairy case which is about perfect. I cut a 6" vent near bottom and installed a 3" flexiable hose at top. Hose runs down 18"to connect to a box containing fan from dairy case. The descending hose prevents heat lose by natural convection (warm air rises,cold air drops.) The thermostat has one set of contacts that make on temperature rise above an adjustible 32F to 55F and break as temperature drops which in turn control cooling compressor. There is a secound set of contacts which make and break inverse to first set. When unnessary components were stripped,I retained defrost heaters and connected them to the secound set of contacts which make on temp fall turning heaters on then break when temp reaches 45-50F. Another salvaged t-stat was mounted high in case, internally altered to perform in the 80F range and connected to fan. I save and raid gas station island trash for black oil,trans fluid and anti-freeze jugs. Jugs are filled with weak mix of water/anti-freeze then placed inside case where solar heat is stored then released during night to miniumize energy used by defrost heaters. A chime is connected parallel with heaters and a buzzer with fan to allow me to dial them in. Plants sit near top in colder weather then decend to lower shelves as they grow and weather milds. When plants are removed from flats they go into 1 gallon pots. Cumulativly, years tinkering has shown as cu ft space inside frame increases, maintaining temperature becomes increasingly easier. Gallon pots ease moisture and nutrient maintainance, reduce transplant shock and alow plants to hit the ground running. I hope this was relivant to your question.
The temperatures ( 50F ++) is just fine.
Now if you keep them in the shady place, there is no need to cover them with shade cloth. A couple hours of morning sun should be ok to start.
One more thing: Can you keep your basement cooler for few days before moving your plants out ? For example by opening windows (if there are any).
But all in all min. temp of 50F should not be too shocking, especially when you bring them out in the morning when it starts getting warmer out side. The purpose of hardening of it to avoid big changes in temperature for a few few days until the get used to it. Tomatoe can tolerate temperatures as low as 37F, provided it is done gradually. But in your case 50F is nothing to be concerned about.
Sey
Howdy Hudson.
On August 18th, 2013, you posted a Better Boy and Brandy Boy Cross. Meant to ask if you followed up by saving seed and replanting it? I realize that there's a lot of variance in the F2 and F3 generations, but if good lineage(s) are selected and stabilized then *Better Brandy Boy OP* could be a real keeper.
Oh, btw, i'm going to flood my friends, family and coworkers with extra Brandy Boy starts this year, haha. They're doing great in real sunshine as opposed to indoor lighting, they will be ready for plant-out the 2nd or 3rd week of May, which is the norm around here.
Steve
Your are right PC - besides - I got to smell my fingers after pruning some suckers this morning - haha. Good luck on the Dwarf BB - I would plant it!
Hi Steve - no, I didn't save the seeds on the cross - but think I may when I retire and have more time to keep track of things - guess I will leave it to Burpee and PC for the time being - haha.
<A question though, why would a mega bloom place anymore stress on the plant than if the blossoms did not fuse and 2 or 3 tomatoes were forming from the separate blossoms?>
Normal growth vs. abnormal growth. My arthritic knees working in the garden vs. your healthy ones ones working in the garden. Big difference. :)
In this case the central stem would have kept growing, providing circulation of water and nutrients. Now it can't.
All you have to do to get your zone location added like the rest of us is to go to your profile page here - just click on your name - and add it in the slot provided. From then on it is automatic.
Dave
The early ones in the big high tunnel are Polbig, BHN 1021, Cherokee Purple, BHN 871 and BHN876, FL 91 and Big Beef. The picture with the coffee can in it are Big Beef.
Blooms will be opening up this weekend I bet. We will have tomatoes before anyone at the market and after everyone at the market. As for most, it is our #1 crop.
Jay
Alright JR. Have a home run !
Most of your varieties are not familiar to me. Maybe they are available for the big guys. But I am growing Big Beef, (op + F1, one of each) for the first time. I have heard so much positive about it that I had to have it.
Have a great season !
Sey
To Labradors: I now live in the country and have armadillos who can make a small hole to a 5" diameter 7" deep. We have a horse that can step in the hole and break a leg. Armadillos are weapon bait. They have moved as far east and north as NC from AZ and NM.
To Labradors: Are you urban or rural? What quadrant of the U.S. do you live? Describe the hole? Armadillos most often dig a small golf ball sized hole that is somewhat cone shaped like their head. Sometimes they can dig something 8 to 10 inches in diameter at an angle going down, typically around cover like bushes, but not always. I purchased a system called "Dakota Alert" which has a receiver in the house and a transmitter outside. They also sell a hand held receiver. They can be set to zones one through four. They can transmit a quarter mile through trees, bushes and other plants. I have four of them spread out. When the armadillos wake me up I can handle them. They are also great security systems.
I think the soil temperature is also a major factor.
I keep checking it. It is about 52F now. But I have covered the raised beds with black plastic since early Feb. I just cut a (+ sign) shape and plant and keep the plastic til August .
I have only noticed that growth is slow but they do grow once the roots grab the soil. At the end of season some of my indets get over 8 ft tall..
Cool weather is a fact of life here at PNW. Our nights low will reach 50F+ sometime in early June. May's average night lows is ~ 47F. June's average night low is about 53 F. July and August average low is about 56 - 58F. Only one or two days in summer the highs reach and exceed 86F. That is why our Heat Zone number is "ONE", a lonely number :D.
The above statistics are for north of Seattle (Redmond area).
So here it is not worth it to wait for the warm weather to arrive soon, like in Mid West zone 5,6, 7..
Wish me a hot season. hehe
Sey
I understand that, Sey. What I'm talking about is the "cold turkey" approach.
<They look a little droopy since they went from 70 degrees to a cool 45 with a little rain last night. >
From 70+ degrees zapped to 45 degrees and rain. There is no need for or benefit to that. That is not hardening off no matter how you define it and those plants in the first picture were damagedas a resultof doing it.
And based on the comment
<I wanted them to go into shock to stunt their growth.>
It was intentional.
Dave
I also prefer straw especially if it is free:-). But you might get some rye or wheat growing in it . Also with the hay you might get weeds.
My other favorite mulch is pine straw. Down in GA you can get plenty of it at reasonable prices. HD used to sell it trucks load of it. It is the most common landscaping mulch down there. But Up here in PNW all I can get is pine bark mulch or nuggets. @ 2 bucks per cubic foot. Not bad.
Sey
<Basically I would be worried about any potential pesticides if I don't know where its coming from. Or is that not something typically used in straw?>
Herbicides is more of a concern than pesticides. Longer lasting and more damage. But neither is commonly used with grain crops IME and if the bales are aged more than a year old they'd be of minimal concern.
Dave
I have tried the water spray method. Didn't work. It knocked off quite a few but the next day they were all clustered at the end of the young texas mimosa plant that I have been nurturing from seed. I have not noticed them on my garden veggies yet and that has me worried that they will jump ship and spread to the garden plants. The ants are taking very good care of them. I have seen ladybugs around but they don't seem to be doing anything about the black bean aphids. I have also tried Neem Oil spray and that doesn't seem to phase them. Today dusted them with Diomataceous Earth and it also didn't seem to phase them. It got rid of the nursing ants but not the aphids. I think in order for the D-earth to work they actually need to move around somewhat, which the aphids just seem to sit there and suck away at the stem ends. I've tried picking them off but after about fifteen minutes of that I begin to see double. Well, I will try the garlic and onion and oil mixture next.
I would like to add a point here:
DO NOT expect to get rid of aphids in one application/shot. Aphids have more than one stage of life besides being tough.
I will continue with light treatment with jet spray until i don't see them anymore.
Sey
see this video from Univ of Maine: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XSf3aSj46jo
This is how I have been doing it for years. While it isn't exactly a weave, it supports the plants and does a great job. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ZHEL0_uBww