16,949 Garden Web Discussions | Growing Tomatoes
I started out with great intentions, too, but have turned into the Hippie. The tomatoes in raised beds in my backyard are loving our hot weather and growing faster than I've ever seen. The tomatoes in the front yard (plopped in clay soil a few weeks later) are still pretty small, I'm interested to see how they make out. They are extras to share with neighbors, anyway, so it's not a big deal if they don't produce :)
Thanks for posting the article!
Just to clarify, in case this is your worry:
Cross-pollination is only a problem if you're trying to save seed. Cross-pollination will not affect size, shape, color, or flavor of the fruit. The pollen-parent's genetic contribution appears only in the embryos of the seeds of the new fruit, not in the tomato flesh (or even the seed coats).
If you're worried about saving pure seed to grow next year, see the FAQ on preventing cross-pollination:
http://faq.gardenweb.com/faq/lists/tomato/2005025852004159.html
You can find the little tulle bags at Walmart in the wedding aisle of the party supply section. I believe you have your choice of white or silver.
And the larger question to me is for what purpose are you saving seed from some OP varieties.
If for home use then you need not be so concerned but if trading seeds or SSE listing them, etc., then seed purity is more of a concern.
I'm glad you were directed to the FAQ here on How To PRevent Cross POllination b'c there were several of us that spent a good deal of time on that and then it was approved by those who were here at GW at the time. And I'm not all that biased but I do thonk it's perhaps the best discussion of X pollination on the net, and with pictures to boot.
Different insects that can pollinate can fly in excess of two miles, so there's that.
My rows were 250 ft long, plants 3-4 ft apart within the rows and rows 5 ft apart and my cross pollination rate was about 5% meaning that of seed saved from 100 varieties that on average 5 of them would be cross pollinated.
There are lots of variables that play into X pollination and there's an excellent article at SOuthern Exposure Seed Exchange written by Dr. Jeff McCormack who owned SASE before he sold it and he outlined in great detail all those variables.
So while my experience where I grow my stuff says 5% there are places where it can be up to about 50%, but that would be rare.
Carolyn
Dave, I do trust you as to what you described as your growing what was indet, but it's not just what I've seen reported at many message sites and online.
Maybe the following is happening.
Tom Wagner's original Green Grape was indet. I was growing it here at my new place and the plants were not indet they were det and had much less fruits than I was accustomed to.
At the time I was posting here at GW and Earl was as well, not One of the Earl's, but another Earl. I got from him seeds for what he said was indet, and when I planted them out they were det.
At the same time Tom was in the Netherlands at Sahin Seeds where Kees had kind of a gathering of European folks for a taste testing. Tom found even there that his GG was det, not the original indet.
Then I was invited to give a dog and pony show at Hortus Nursery in Pasadena and Tom drove down from Bakersfield where he was at the time and brought me two plants that he said were indet. I carried them back on the plane and they turned out to be det as well.
What I'm saying is that the plant habit was flip flopping back and forth between indet and det, and I wonder if the same might be true with Rutgers, going the other way, that is, from det to indet.
DL, one good way to determine if what you have is det or indet is that det varieties have terminal blossom clusters and now I forget the other major difference which is the distance between blossom clusters as well.
No, I don't think I could tell what you have by pictures, I really don't.
Above is a general Google search about Rutgers and det vs indet and lots of good reading on that.
And below I'm linking to one of those links that describes the difference between indet and det. Look for the post by Hoosier who is quoting from Keith Mueller and the internode difference between the two that I couldn't remember.
Carolyn
Here is a link that might be useful: GW link, det vs indet
What I'm saying is that the plant habit was flip flopping back and forth between indet and det, and I wonder if the same might be true with Rutgers, going the other way, that is, from det to indet.
That's exactly what I have suspected as well for the past several years as it would explain much of the performance issues.
I always prefer to give benefit-of-a-doubt to seed suppliers and something like genetic instability let's me do that. :)
Dave
I know Carolyn.
I would rather have the Squirrels here also BUT not at the expense of them destroying all my tomatoes and my blueberries and 1000s of dollars of damage to my neighbors house.
If they weren't lil ecoterrorist I would love watching them.
But they are WAY too destructive when you have dozens of them all over.
I have electric fence to keep the deer out, but after seeing the ecoterrorusts at work I strung one strand about two inches off the ground. I actually wrapped the fencing around each post because there were now slots as low as I needed.
Nothing has given me such a chuckle in a long time, seeing them scamper between that wire and the next one up and hear the POP when their tails touch it. I am a sick and twisted person. There is much consternation in squirrel land. :))
It isn't bad for a tomato plant to be watered from above when it rains, is it? What's the difference?
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There is some pretty interesting research out there that talks about how lightening is powerful enough to break apart the nitrogen so that it is available to the plants. You aren't getting that from a garden hose.
Also, most rain showers are accompanied by wind, which helps stimulate growth and dry the leaves.
We need to know where you live or at least what gardening zone you are in. Different diseases are strictly regional.
It would also help to see a picture of the plant if possible.
We also need to know if this plant is in the ground or in a container. If a container, how big is it?
Does the plant respond - perk up - to watering?
Much more info please.
Dave
looks like a nice planter (raised bed).
Digdirt is entirely correct on all counts except maybe the watering, that totally depends on what potting mix and type of plants and how big they are in the bed, how hot it is etc.
If it is good draining mix in a very good draining planter then you could easily water it every day.
I water mine about 6 days a week.
Buy some good "Potting Mix" not top soil, can amend it with some large perlite and pine bark to get it to drain better.
FILL that planter to within an inch of the top, make sure there are "several" drainage holes in the bottom.
On something that size with a flat bottom I would probably put 30 or more 1/2" holes in the bottom.
It is likely that if you just had that planter full of dirt, even heavy top soil that the plants may have at least not rotted. You have heavy soil, probably in a not so well draining container, with only that tiny amount of soil the roots are probably sitting in water in the "perched water" in bottom few inches of soil.
First 2nd and 3rd thing you gotta do is Drainage drainage drainage.
These are in containers? Or in the ground? I don't know why everyone always assumes we automatically know that when it makes such a big difference in the replies.
Ants, with the exception of fire ants, while they provide no pollination assistance, are normally not considered an issue in gardens but in containers they can pose a problem if you don't ID what is attracting them. If they set up a full colony in a container the roots can be badly damaged.
So if it is a container, move it to a different location and let it dry out as much as possible before watering it again since it is the moisture they are after. Even so far as to let the plant wilt a bit. The ants will leave. If the plants are in ground don't worry about it.
Dave
Tomatoes are self fertile. With an 8 mph wind you have the perfect pollinator already in place. I would imagine fruit isn't setting because the plants are stressed. Even under ideal container conditions you are looking at 30-40% of normal production. There was a recent post about this. Throw in the Houston climate and I think you should feel good if you get anywhere near 30% of a normal yield.
To improve you chances, I would try to stick to cherry types or go really big with the container - i.e. full wine barrel.
Looks like tobacco Mosaic virus to me.
Here is a link that might be useful: tobacco mosaic virus
I'd suggest a fungicide for the pepper plants ranter than Neem. They look like Alternaia.
Soil spraying fungicides - personally I don't see how they can be effective on more that the surface but products for soil drenching are available, expensive but available. Your choice. One of those can't hurt and might help situations. Forked, sun exposed, and left to dry out well kills much of an soil fungus.
Dave
Do you mean to spray peppers with a copper fungicide? Neem oil is listed as a fungicide against alternaria. I have never had to get into heavy fungicide use before and have never used a copper spray.
I am letting the soil dry out really good. No rain in the forecast and getting hotter all week.
Thanks,
Kate