16,949 Garden Web Discussions | Growing Tomatoes
We had late blight for the first time ever a couple of years ago. Last year I made sure to turn off the overhead sprinklers on the tomatoes and was really careful about watering only the soil. I also bought some bordeaux mixture (a copper-based fungicide), but never had to resort to using it.
I just want to go back to bmoser's comment about growing in whiskey barrels. I have one that I grew tomatoes in twice. The first time I grew some kind of brandywine and the next year I grew super marzano. Both developed BER. The brandywine actually died due to root rot early in the season without ever producing a healthy tomato. When I discovered the root rot I added six more half- inch holes in the bottom and another six on the sides around the bottom before trying the San marzanos. But we had a lot of rain that year and the wood of the barrel swelled so much, I had to regularly clear out the drainage holes. Even so, I almost never watered the pot all summer. I got a huge yeild but almost every tomato had BER to season's end. I never had a similar problem in other kinds of pots and have to water them all at least every three days. Now I grow watermelon in the whiskey barrel and still have to limit watering. All of this is to say, if your whiskey barrel is like mine, I would not install a drip system. I think the problem could be too much moisture, not too little.
Yes, overwatering can cause edema and leaf curl. It's not unusual to see edema and leaf curling on the same plant. Are your plants sitting on a warm dryer or something? Great for seed germination, not so great for tomatoes that have leaves. Too much of a temperature difference between roots and leaves plus too much water are prime conditions for edema/curling.
We have an electric dryer and small electric space heater in the area. The plants are on a shelf 1 1/2 foot above the laundry appliances. Also, since it's just my husband and I, we don't run the dryer very often. I just noticed too that the only the Italian tomatoes have edema while the leaf curl is only on the Romas. I thought tomatoes are supposed to be easy! LOL. My other seedlings (peppers and watermelons) are thriving so I hope the decreased temperatures won't negatively affect them. ::
I picked up 18 plants at Tomatomania on March 23. I kept them outside during the day and they spent the first 2 nights in the garage. The rest of the time they spent outside till I planted them on 4/2...2 weeks ago today.
They are all doing fine here in Chatsworth \ San Fernando Valley.. Hope this helps and Good Growing to you !
Rob
Years ago, when I was still buying my tomato plants, I would look for the double too. I had great success with them by just taking a knife and slicing through the soil between them. If I recall correctly, they didn't even wilt. but I had repotted them indoors since we had a few weeks before they went out into the garden.
Betsy
Since you've decided you want to keep the "bonus" plant, I would recommend that you separate the two and not grow them together. If they are too close (less than at least a foot apart) they will compete for food, sun and water. The yield of each plant will be lower and the chance for disease will be much higher because of poor air circulation.
Since these plants are only 6 weeks old, I'm wondering if panentheos is talking about actual branches/suckers, or simply large leaves. Many people are confused by tomato anatomy.
If the "branch" doesn't end in a growing tip (tiny stem with miniature leaves), it's not a branch -- it's either a leaf (large, compound leaf with lots of leaflets) or a flower truss (small branch with flower buds). [In a small percentage of varieties, there may be leaflets at the end of a flower truss, and in rare cases a branch will grow from the end of the truss, but that shouldn't be seen in a 6 week old plant.]
Here are photos of leaves from different tomato varieties. Each photo shows a single leaf.
http://www.wintersown.org/wseo1/Black_Cherry.html (note the side stems or petiolules, each with multiple leaflets)
http://www.wintersown.org/wseo1/Black_Ethiopian.html
http://www.wintersown.org/wseo1/Brandywine.html
http://www.wintersown.org/wseo1/Black_Krim.html
http://www.wintersown.org/wseo1/BrandyBoy.html
As far as trimming the end leaflets off long leaves: that shouldn't be a problem. It will slightly limit the energy available to the plant. But if you have a real jungle, with the leaves of different plants tangling together, so that you have difficulty separating them without tearing the plants, trimming might be a good idea.
Thanks for the responses! I do mean trimming just the leaves, not the growing tips. And I was indeed using the wrong terminology in calling them branches, so I appreciate the correction.
It sounds like trimming the leaves back a bit won't cause major problems, except for reducing light exposure a bit. That's already happening due to the overcrowding though, so I'll probably do it to keep them from tangling up. Thanks again!
Hi Mulio & Phildeez, I wonder if you could update this thread about the Black Italian Tomatoes as I can find very little on the web. Someone gave me seed from France labeled Black Italian but that is the only information I have. The plants are very sturdy and healthy. We are hoping they will produce black tomatoes like the ones in your photos. My question is, if we save seed from these plants (assuming they are planted far enough away from other tomatoes not to cross pollinate), is it likely to produce similar plant or is the Black Italian more likely to behave like a hybrid? Any thoughts or info would be appreciated!
Fiorentino, I looked up Black Italian in Ventmarin's database, and they referred to this entry:
Italian Black OP
ou Black Italian OP
ou Italienne Noire OP
Fruit rouge sombre ovale allonge de 30 a 50 grammes. En bouquet de 8 a 12 fruits. Absence de trace a l'attache pedonculaire. Absence de trace a l'ombilic. 2 loges. Variete bien adaptee au sechage. Plant de 180 a 220 centimetres de hauteur. 65 a 75 jours. Variete fixee originaire d'Italie. [diacritical marks removed as GW doesn't show them correctly]
In case you don't read French, my rough translation is that this is a red-black with an elongated oval shape. Weight is 30-50 grams (1-1.8 oz.). Two cells/seed cavities. A good variety for dehydrating. The plant grows to about 6-7'. 65-75 days to maturity. Open pollinated. Italian origin.
They don't say, but it's apparently a plum paste.
Photos here:
http://ventmarin.free.fr/passion_tomates/tomates_i_hihi/italian_black.htm
The entry I quoted is here:
http://ventmarin.free.fr/passion_tomates/tomates_i_hihi/tomates_i.htm
And here's a link to the page in Tatiana's TOMATOBase:
http://t.tatianastomatobase.com:88/wiki/Italian_Black
So yes, it's not a hybrid and you can save seeds.
It's also not one of the anthocyanin-rich tomatoes now being called "black" (or blue) such as the ones discussed earlier in this thread and also on the recent Indigo Rose thread
http://forums.gardenweb.com/forums/load/tomato/msg0322301318384.html?15
but is "black" in the sense of older varieties such as Black Krim, Paul Robeson, Black Cherry, Carbon, Brad's Black Heart, Sara Black, Nyagous, Ananas Noire, etc.
marullo
If the tomato was developed in the 50's and "What resulted was the wonderful, and soon to become extremely popular Ultomato Apocolypse." then I am sure we would have heard of it before now.
Personally, I think it is probably marketing hype of a known tomato that has been renamed so that someone could make some money off noobs who don't know any better.
If it was intended as humor, I'm guessing it missed its mark.
Betsy
That makes sense to me. Looks like I got taken (message had been forwarded to me) If it were accurate, I thought that some expert on the forum could confirm. Seemed a bit too strange to be true but some tomatoes have legends that are almost as weird. If no one here has heard of it, it must not exist.
You can save seeds from the hybrids too but they might produce offpsring with slight differences, but some may also be stable. You won't know until you grow them out, and then you save seeds from the best of the best, repeat year to year to develop a set of seed the reproduce truly with the chracteristics you like.
Yes we grow in them all year around. In the summer, we pull up the sides, open up the endwalls and let the breeze blow through. We usually have a good breeze all summer so that helps. But it can get warm in there. I would like to buy some shade cloth and use that to keep temps down, but I haven't made that investment yet.
Jay
Terrybull: I think you mean to choose one of the second, third or fourth steps, not to take all your steps? I've never had leaf minors, but I have had other pests that any one of those last three steps would have eliminated. I particularly like spinosad, which seems gentle on the plants but deadly for most leaf sucking and chewing insects. Be sure not to apply any insecticide in full sun. I do mine in early evening.
thank you for the replies, i will try your suggestions...is it possible for the plant to recover at this point? alot of the leaf look like the photos except the new one forming at the top. this is the first time anything has been planted in that garden bed.
I will have to research permaculture. It sounds like it could be the answer. I was thinking today when I had to go pay big bucks for water souluable nitrogen that this is getting expensive now that fertilizer prices have gone up so much.
One thing about permaculture, is that you can take it as far or as little as you want. I haven't really gotten into the low maintenance edible landscape (yet), and all the layers it entails, but the practices used to restore soil, recycle nutrients, conserve water and reduce inputs are very valid for all gardeners. If you saw my property before and after, you wouldn't believe the difference in the lushness.