16,949 Garden Web Discussions | Growing Tomatoes
Marie Danilenko was SSE's contact in Russia and sent many different varieties to SSE and one summer I was asked to trial quite a few of them and Cosmonaut Volkov was one of them.
Dave, the pictures of CV that you linked to and my own Googling of it for IMAGES and non Images do not look like the CVolkov I grew with seeds directly to SSE frim marie in Moscow.
I then went to my latest SSE 2014 Yearbook and began to smile since several listers said ROUND and RED, which is what I remembered, And that b'c thee were a couple of others that had been sent and they were ALL round and red.
The folks who said that got their seeds from Fedco.
Where all these beefsteaky ones come from I don't know.
Is it worth getting just one variety from Fedco? You have to request a catalog or download everything via pdf. and right now I don't even know if they still list it since those who said round said they got it in 2005,
Is it a great tomato, one I would want to grow a lot, well not IMO but one has to grow a variety to know. Several sites say it is an heirloom, but it was not, as Tania clearly wrote.
Carolyn
Dave, the pictures of CV that you linked to and my own Googling of it for IMAGES and non Images do not look like the CVolkov I grew with seeds directly to SSE frim marie in Moscow.
Yeah wasn't offering them for the pics but as sources to buy. Point was the pics are not all that relevant any time. As we know many sources use common pics. But at the same time given that it is an OP variety different fruit appearance on the same vine happens as with many OPs.
The CV I grow produce some with slightly ruffled tops and some smooth round and some with an almost semi-pear shape. It isn't stable even after 4 years of selecting for the smooth round. That's why I won't trade seeds from it.
Dave
I am kind of curious about the OP's tomatoes. She said the two tomatoes in the photo are both equally ripe, but the one on the right really doesn't look ripe. I've not seen mine ripen without the color changing and I don't think I've read about anyone else having them ripen with no color change at all. But it is my first year growing them.
I've fallen in love with Azoychka this year. If you want a tart tomato heavy on the acidic taste, then Azoychka is it. It really reminds me of lemon juice. And it's sunny yellow. So maybe that's one to consider?
Angie
A few that I have grown this year.
1. Husky Cherry Red (Bonnie Plants seedling.) Very productive till the super high heat kicked in. (98+ 60 to 85% humidity.) Even when super hot it still produced some. Taste is a bit more to the tart side. Think a Slightly more tangy sweet 100 with skin that is not a tough. The plant stays pretty compact as well. Will grow again. Early producer.
2. Creole hybrid (Again a Bonnie 1 gal seedling.) The plant stayed compact to less than 5 feet tall. Was very productive with well over 50 on each plant. Fruit was tasty. Will grow again. One of the earliest to set fruit. Was a little later than a couple of others for ripening.
3. Black Prince heirloom (4 inch Bonnie seedlings.) Both produced over 80 tomatoes each. Were the second plants to produce. First to give off ripe fruit for non cherry plants. I had to be watchful. If they broke color I had to pick them quick. we were getting a lot of rain, and they were prone to cracking. If color had broke they would split to the meat. The skins are thin, and tender. I took cuttings to restart the plants before I pulled them. They do not tolerate Texas summers. Seeds saved. I will grow them again. They tasted great, produced early. I now know to go ahead and pull the plants once the last of the ripe fruit are picked.
Parks Whopper hybrid. (Another Bonnie) Productive. Tasty enough. Very large fruit, that will make a 3/4 inch slice that will cover more than the hamburger bun. Plants need some space. It has survived the heat, and I have gotten a few tomatoes off of it. Most small for the plant size. Tasty none the less. Will plant again.
Mr. Stripey Heirloom (Bonnie plant as well.) 4 Inch seedling was started in late March. First ripe fruit was in early June. Yield was 15 large ripe fruit. The heat shut the production of this one down quick. Plant is still alive so I am hoping for a few more when the weather cools down. Will plant again with a way larger plant next year.
There are more though I am pressed for time to take care of some things so will post more later.
Nate
Lindalana, that sounds like a support I put together for some runner beans this year. It's been working great.....so far. The metal spikes on the top cage looked dangerous sticking up into the air so I curled them around using a needle-nosed pliers to get a good grip on them. Looks kinda like some cool garden sculpture :) Guess you have to have a good imagination to see it as art, but the hummingbirds like to visit just fine.
Um, err, Chocolate Cherry is not an heirloom variety, it was bred by Aaron Whaley, when he was still at SSE in Decorah, IA.
His mother and father, Diane and Kent Whealey, yes, Aaron changed his last name, started SSE in 1975.
There's also a Brown Berry, and that one was bred by Sahin Seeds in Holland
But there are some newer dark cherries coming up and one of them is Black Opal and one of my seed producers( no, I'm not commercial) is doing that one this summer for me.
Aha, I almost forgot Kazachka, an excellent dark cherry/
Carolyn
Here is a link that might be useful: Chocolate Cherry
One of the "Cuostralee" plants I mentioned in my post just gave me a yellow tomato, so I really have no idea what variety it is.
Good point! Possible but highly unprobable.
Our family has a similar operation to your plan, a nursery business and grow to sell both transplants and fruit at farmer's market. So keeping in mind that an off seed in a packet or mis-labeld packet is always a slim possibility all I can tell you is the seed suppliers we count on and have for years:
There are others we have used but those are our primary suppliers.
Dave
pk, there is NO place that sells OP seed that has a perfect record. It's impossible to do b'c most of the places that most deal with have hundreds of plants out each year and cannot bag blossoms and cannot use geographic isolation.
And some places subcontract out for seed production as well.
I started growing Cuostralee back in 1993 as Tania describes in her link to this variety, but I should add that the seed trade with Norbert in 1992 included not just Craig and myself, but also Joe Bratka and Bill Minkey as well. Link below.
I've SSE listed it, I've offered it in many seed offers in the past and have never seen a Yellow Cuostralee myself or at any of the message sites where I read and sometimes post.
If it's just one plant that gave all yellow tomatoes, it's a stray seed. Had it been one fruit on a plant or one branch on a plant that would be a somatic mutation which is a totally different issue.
The epidermis of Cuostralee is yellow If there had been a mutation to a clear epidermis it would have been pink, and yes, some have seen some pink fruited plants since the mutation between clear and yellow is not all that rare.
I never distributed seeds for anything other than what the original color should be, with few exceptions such as FishLake Oxheart when there was a mutaional change,but of late, many have been doing that, Sigh.
Hope that helps.
Carolyn
Here is a link that might be useful: Cuostralee
I believe bigger container sizes have advantages:
-- Less frequent watering, fertilizing.
-- Provides stability against tipping over.
-- It is easier to stake or cage
In short it is less challenging and offers more convenience.
As far as the root system and plants nutrients need are concerned, it can be done in small containers ( 5-7gal.) too. But it will need ongoing attention. As the size of container gets bigger and bigger, it becomes similar to growing in the garden (relatively speaking). I have 4 tomatoes growing in about 5 gal. containers. But i water and fertilize them maybe 3 times as often as those in the ground. They are doing fine but I have to work 3 times harder. NOT very convenient. Ten gallon container could have reduced my work load by more than 50%, I estimate.
What are the disadvantages of bigger pots?
1- container cost
2- potting soil cost: They are costly !
I roughly estimate: $2/gal for both container and potting mix.
So if a 5 gal. arrangement cost $ 8 - $10, a 12 gallon will cost about $20-$25. If you are willing to pay the price , you will get a lot of payback in convenience.
Agree. We get lots of requests to try to do this every year and if you pull them all up with the search you'll find the answer is always the same - not possible.
It could easily be any one of at least 50 different varieties. Just gorw and enjoy it and don't worry about the name - call it what you wish.
Dave
Been there and done that with the help of Carolyn.
Just grow and enjoy it and don't worry about the name - call it what you wish.
Yes, I find it fun to give it a home-grown descriptive name rather than think of it as an orphan, and if you save the seeds do it with that name since if you're like me, unlabeled seeds usually get tossed. Hmmm ... Pale Indian Corn tomato ... or Sweet Jalapeño tomato ... Piccolo Corno di Toro LOL
Leafminers. If it's only a few leaves and the plant is large enough you can just pick off the affected leaves and dispose of them. If it's a lot of leaves or a small plant you might try squishing them with your fingers (while wearing gloves if you want).
Rodney
I've seen a few examples of people planting in straw bale gardens online and they have never done well. I don't know what the premise behind using them as opposed to planting into soil. Maybe to avoid nematodes? Then I would look at raised beds and large pots. Seems to me that soil would have and/or retain more nutrients than a bale of straw.
I water my outdoor plants once, sometimes twice a day,..
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That tells me:
-- There is not enough soil in the container OR
-- The soil does not retain moisture.
-- When you water that volume of soil that often, the nutrients are washed down with the excess water coming out of it. I think then you should add fertilizer (@ 1/3 strength) every third time that you water, the way you have said.
JMO
Thanks Seysonn, yeah, I water a lot, as much for heat as anything, but I didn't think the nutrients would wash out since I'm watering from below. Guess that's not the case . . .
The last thing that put it together for me is that my young grape vines and citrus trees are absolutely flourishing, and neither of those need much in the way of fertilization when they're small. Meanwhile my tomatoes, which need a lot of fertilizer are struggling. I think I need a stable fertilization regiment.
Looking good! Glad you found the culprit!
Hi lindalana!
I haven't had much time today to think more about this than last night's post, but there's just a few things. My plants are recovering, but it is from copper sulfate damage, my fault for applying it too late in the morning. So, no mold to be seen but, complete loss of flowering and I've now removed about 20% of the leaves ... the fried ones.
Now just adding little of vinegar to peroxide will help?
This is the big question and someone else may know the answer from experience. Yes it will help, but how much it will help ... hmmm, not sure because we need to establish our goals first.
* how exactly do we plan to use solution?
* how much working solution will satisfy our need?
* how many ppm of peracetic acid do we need to do that
* how long does a mixture of H2O2 + Acetic acid take to produce the peracetic acid
*what is the lowest pH our solution can be and not injure plants
* what is the ppm of the 2.5 gallon preparation in a working solution, for comparison. I'm thinking 150 ppm to 300 ppm.
Foliar like for my mold situation, or to treat seeds .... Where can we get these ppm application rates ... I had no luck with Google. Also, does distilled vinegar contain other chemicals besides acetic acid that are undesirable...
My thinking right now is to pour equal volumes of Walmart stuff (WM) 3% peroxide and 5% vinegar and leave them in a dark place for a couple of weeks, then dilute them with de-chlorinated water so it ends up in one part WM vinegar, one part WM H2O2, and two parts water, and immediately apply as the peracetic acid will begin to revert. That might get us into the ball park application rate of 150 ppm peracetic acid, but we need to verify that. I think I saw peracetic acid test strips somewhere, but they were expensive. In order to experiment let's see if we can find a deal on them so we can get some results to interpret.
Still, I want to add, it seems peroxide and vinegar from Walmart are less expensive, but actually the reverse is true. Per liter of working solution, we will pay more. If I am not mistaken the concentrated stuff is applied 1:100 (?) and if the shipped cost of 2.5 gallons is $225 for example, that's $90 per gallon. For 100 gallons final solution, that's $0.90 per gallon. If we do a quart of peroxide and a quart of vinegar, it will cost more than that and likely be enriched in vinegar and H2O2 at the expense of lower peracetic acid because of all the water in the Walmart concentrate we make.
Now, if I wanted this stuff, observing flawless safety practice, I would find a local source of "food grade peroxide" which properly nabbed should be $25 a gallon to go and pick it up ... just where to find it...and, I would buy a liter of glacial acetic acid for about $20, much cheaper if I didn't order it online and had some locally. That would make my cost under $75 for the $225 approx commercial product. Alternately, we could concentrate the peroxide and acetic acid from WM to an intermediate strength and probably get much better results. But that is a very wasteful thing to do at home, a little dangerous, and unless we assay what we get, difficult to be sure of the home prepared WM stuff we concentrate. As it is, even if we can just mix the two WM as is, it is per gallon working solution much more expensive even than the commercial product, which itself is triple the concentrate cost made from food grade 35% peroxide and glacial.
Lots of possibilities floating around here but we need to get back to the basics which could advance this. They are to determine the ppm peracetic acid we require and seeing if we can get cheap peracetic test strips somewhere. Also, can we get a better MSDS on the ready to use Oxidate and especially know the pH of that stuff as sold. The benefit of the commercial product is getting the correct application rate by mixing according to directions, and with a home brew, we need to know the ppm and reproducibly make it on demand. Until we get that we have no way of optimizing except by trial and error with the plants. If someone else has done that would save a lot of work! People who work in plant labs might know these ppms off the top of their heads.
Thoughts?
PC
This post was edited by PupillaCharites on Thu, Sep 4, 14 at 12:30