16,949 Garden Web Discussions | Growing Tomatoes
Same in my area with Bonnie being the one and only choice in BBS. Just don't like paying $4 per plant when I used to get a SIX pack for $1.80. At $1/lb at summer farmers markets, I'm 4 lbs in the hole months before picking any.
I'm more motivated to start my own from seed now; lower cost and I know I'll get the variety I want.
My local Lowes hosts a Bonnie Plants display with about 100 starter tomato plants and they are the saddest leaf eaten yellowest tomato plants I've ever seen. They are $6.40 with tax each. Too bad, they had some Mortgage Lifters, right next to the 42" tomato ring cages LOL Look around for a local nursery for 6-packs. Bonnie Plants pulls a few good varieties out of the hat these days, but they are reshaping the costs of gardening here with a total monopoly.
I don't think it is working out well and I think we have the highest prices of anyone mentioning their Bonnie prices in the thread because Florida is about as hard as it gets on their consignment strategy. I think they are losing three plants to every one they sell, so in the end it is the home gardener who is paying for their monopoly. Support your local nursery if you can!
Today I removed ALL the suckers that have no flowers. Here in Long Island (NY) I hope we will have about 1 month of nice weather. 1 month might not be enough for all the late season tomatoes - that now are flowers - to ripe, but cherries and mid season will be ok.
According to a "tomato timeline" posted here before and linked many times, It take about 52 days from the bud to the ripe fruit. This is for large fruits in the middle of growing season. But it can take shorter/less time for cherry types/sizes and smaller tomatoes. But I think later in the season and in cooler climates it can even take longer.
So then you have to factor in the effect of late season cool weather that will slow down the growth and ripening of fruits significantly. For example my FFD is around mid November but our October weather will be too cold (and rainy/cloudy).
So I would count backward 50 days from my average frost date ( say Nov. 10 -20th ) and start my pinch off schedule ( Sep 20 to 30th). And that is an optimistic outlook here. Even then probably I will end up with plenty of green tomatoes to pickle.
So you have to decide what is best for you.
mmm, not what you ask but Sweet Olive F1 hybrid I am told one of the best grapes in taste. I got the seeds from Johnny's just to try because it is being discontinued here and it is UK seed I think...
This post was edited by lindalana on Fri, Aug 8, 14 at 14:39
best grape taste for a $1 how can I refuse lindalana.. thanks I quickly ended up with a nice little seed order from Johhnys. :)
great info fusion_power thanks... I think I am going to end up either with sugary or sprite... I am tempted by sprite because it would be nice to have a determinate in the mix (I currently have none) but the "very sweet" description of the sugary is tempting.
Welcome, I'm new here too. If you want to try to cross the two varieties, go for it for fun. But breeding tomatoes to get a stable plant is not something you can do like this to get a new tomato in the first generation of the cross (your pollinated flowers' fruits' seeds.
When you breed a tomato like this from a hybrid and an open pollinated variety, you are usually looking to make something of a particular characteristic set. Because better boy is a hybrid, it won't breed true and you will get a motley crew of offspring exhibiting many traits which will not transfer the qualities of Better Boy, including the disease resistances. On the other hand the OP cherry will give another level of complexity when mixed in, giving you many different tomatoes. Since you will lose many of the good characteristics, you won't likely be happy with most of what you produce, but you will have tomato plants.
But ... if you have a lot of growing area, take good notes, and have a bunch of pathogens to inoculate your newly planted seeds from the cross, you can eliminate the plants that don't have the resistances you want (like using Round-up), and then you will need to grow the rest out and see about viability, yield, and finally taste and texture.
Now that you grew say 500 plants and ended up with one that was ok, but not really better than anything, you have to plant and select the best seeds in a similar fashion for several more generations, until your improved cultivar becomes stable ... that means it the seeds produce an open pollinated tomato you can count on being the same and definable.
Then you can pay $5000 and register it and sell it to get your money back ;-) if you have buyers who think it's great.
Otherwise, genetics like this is like playing the lottery. Maybe you'll get lucky, you never know ;-)
As to whether the cross is a good one, there are many criteria to judge that. But first, you need to ask what exactly you want to accomplish, otherwise it can be subjective, seat of the pants. But that can be great fun ... with benefits after years of dedication and obsession ;-) JMO
The link below will help you know how to make crosses and how long you need to make selections to get to a final stable selection. Start by looking at CULTURE in that link.
First, you have to have a goal.So what is your reason for wanting to cross Better Boy F1 with largeRed Cherry,which is OP. and note that small fruit is dominant to large fruit.
If you save the Seeds from Better Boy, the F2 seeds, and put out a lot of plants you probably won't get either of the parents back/
Let me use Big boy F1 as an example.One parent of that is Teddy Jones, a family OP heirloom from the midwest.I wanted to see if I could get it out, and at the time my mentor was Dr.Oved Shifriss who bred Big Boy F1. He said I could not get more than 80%of the TJ genes out/
Better Boy F1 also has one parent that is Teddy Jones and the analogy would be the same/
So first you need to have a goal, and with that goal in mind, then chose what parents might be the best to attain that goal.
Carolyn
Here is a link that might be useful: crossing/genetic segregation
Tomato fruits can get sunburned (sunscald), especially when the temperatures are over 85F for a while. Different varieties respond differently, and optimally they would not be in killer sunshine. But completely shaded arguably might not be best either since some people say chlorophyll on green tomatoes, especially heirlooms persists a while to help make them sweeter by making more sugars. But unless you are seeing problems on your tomatoes, don't worry about it. People that have problems typically have denuded their plants in response to saving it from some blight, leaving naked fruits in hot sun.
The problem is the Sun is like a microwave oven and can heat up the surface more than the ambient temperature from simple air contact. So the surfaces of the tomatoes' surfaces can near 100 degrees even if the temp is 92F out, like here in Florida. If you don't have a problem, no need to fix it.
This post was edited by PupillaCharites on Fri, Aug 8, 14 at 18:05
"What I think we are looking at are adventitious white roots budding out of the stem due to the plant's being nutrient sucked and root expansion/infection in a nematode explosion in the pot's soil, and severe galling there."
"The severe galling is apparent in the lighter green colored roots in the foreground, that's just a veneer of algae coloring the white sick roots that are exposed, from the eroded soil on top showing the legume-pod-shaped root nodules."
Ahh! That makes sense!
Florida can start a second season in August, right? Can't see why you wouldn't try with a rooted stem. When tomatoes are healthy, they have impressed me with their resilience. But DAAAAMN, when they are not, it seems hopeless.
I have a 1/2 acre in California, near the central valley, but have all but given up growing veg in the ground. Earthboxes have renewed my zeal.
Florida can start a second season in August, right? Can't see why you wouldn't try with a rooted stem. When tomatoes are healthy, they have impressed me with their resilience. But DAAAAMN, when they are not, it seems hopeless.
Yes, it would be nice to start, inside, in July, so if these turn out disease free enough and like typical rooted suckers they are right on time. My zone is borderline Florida and challenging and frustrating as it goes back and forth. The Sun is somewhat better than San Diego for winter, but humid and more cloud cover, and vulnerable to arctic air which routinely reaches Georgia.
Unfortunately trees block my southern exposure during the key hours of midday in winter. They have the best conditions south of me, mid-state for winter sunshine.
Just finished scavenging 14 suckers and tips and put 12 in growing media and two in water for two I didn't have room for to watch anyway. They are somewhat dry and pale, but as you say resilient. The plant is now totally finished and the soil never dried out, if I'm thinking correctly about this, because the root system was shot and the humidity was probably being furnished by some breakdown duce to the nematodes and the fungi they host which are probably some of the unmentionables.
Anyway, the reason I am worried about trying to root them is once the nematodes start, I don't know whether the pathogens they carry would have gone systemic in the plant and it already be too late. I guess I'll find out. I really hate the prospect of potentially culturing sick plants though because in the house I just don't want to be spreading those sorts of spores around (or an errant nematode spawn that magically appears high up on the plant). Because then I'll be concerned about my seedlings getting sick.
I feel so sorry for my plant, the first time I ever named one (Charlie Buckets, a girl LOL) to have lost its last leg and then be butchered by me on its remaining growing tips. It is interesting to see how the plant protected the growing them to the end by somehow transporting nutrients from all the other leaves selectively to them as it crashed in a short time even though the root system wasn't furnishing the pressure from below. That's why I quoted and completely agree with your sentiment!
Good luck with the Earth Boxes, they are fabulous systems and I've made some generic models. The soil here is hopeless. Also the tomatoes are always greener on the other side of the state line, or so I think.
My Old German doesn't look like the rot on this picture. I did go to the F&Q. We drip irrigate, and water is not the problem( the rest of my tomatoes are beautiful ). I think it could be not enough calcium. It appears that the plant needs a great deal of it. Thanks for your responses, but I think that I won't plant this one again, Judy
Marianna and Yaqui have been very productive for me, with large blocky fruit, without much ber. I am growing in eartboxes, and they are supposed to be determinate, but Yaqui is pretty big plant, with no sign of letting up. Can't really vouch for taste, as I grew them specifically for a spicy sauce.
Dave,
Sorry I did not provide more info.
New gardener with plenty to learn.
Grew 4 varities this year, 4 or 5 plants each.
Similar conditions for all 4 varieties. San Marzano although producing some tomatoes (all green so far) the leaves are turning yellow and dying.
Cherokee Purple, Moskvich, and Brandywine all much healthier plants.
I am going to try San Marzano again next year, perhaps different location will make the difference.
I hope the SM blush soon. I have heard they taste very good.
Just One:
-- Has to be early. ( ~ 65 days)
-- To taste good ( not the best but good enough)
-- Good size tomato ( ~ 6 oz)
-- Compact plant (Det, under 3.5 ft)
SILETZ got it .
I Can plant 2 of them in place one HUGE indet. That is like hitting two birds with one stone.
I am growing other early ones too( Matina, Bloody Butcher, Stupice) but the have much smaller fruits ( ~ 1,5 - 2 oz), they are overly tall indets, hard to manage.
Market growers do not sell many varieties. I was in our FM today. Except for a yellow tomato all were red beefsteak type. On top of that, they don't tag the name of what they are selling, is it hybrid, heirloom ???. If you ask the person at the cash register you will hear " I Don't Know ".
Sorry to hear it is that way at your market. Policies are very different around here. For such a low population area we have a surprising number of long-established markets in our area and well-labeled, well-informed heirloom sales are quite popular.
Can't say what they may be like in the Dallas area but hopefully they are better than what you have experienced. Otherwise they serve little purpose. And from the link below it appears there are many of them, several with excellent reviews and at least a couple of them that specialize in heirloom varieties.
Dave
Here is a link that might be useful: Dallas area Farmer's Markets
I'm the D.C. suburbs, so we also tend to have big city type farmers markets. I find that if I ask whatever random person is helping me at my favorite vendor, they usually won't be able to tell me things like the variety of tomato. But there is usually someone there from the actual farm. If I ask that person, they will usually know. It's just a matter of getting the right person. :)
Angie (who will be leaving to visit her local farmers market shortly)
Five years and still going strong: Hurrah for Stupice!
I planted mine out about May 10, From a seedling I bought.
I got the first fruit around July 15. But then no ripe fruits till the end of July. But come August , it is ripening big time.
As I look at some pictures,they show fruits that are round . But mine are lobed. As Carolyn pointed out there are 4 version.
Anyway; Stpice is PROLIFIC indeed. with so many clusters. But the fruits growth and size are not consistent. I will post a picture tomorrow to show you what I mean.
Hurrah for Stupice!
I know this post is rather old, but I wanted to give everybody some peace of mind regarding this subject. I have seen this pop up on forum's and message-boards quite a lot without anyone giving the correct reason.
Which is:
- ) It's not something to worry about too much, because:
- ) There is an abundance of sugars being produced during the photosynthesis period (during the day). So the plant has too much energy.
Reasons could be that during the night the temperature is quite low, so the energy can't be optimally used to produce more roots.
You could try and give some shade to the tomatoplants. Or if you are an indoor grower, you could try to raise the night temperature.
Either way, it's not something to worry about too much and it will go away as soon as fruiting begins (when the plant is using a lot more energy.)
Hope that helps :)
Thanks for answering me.
I don't think one can overwater a plant in a self watering bucket. There is an overflow pipe at the bottom, and I can't add more than 3 litters at once.
The plant is supposed to drink as much as it needs from the reservoir, by capillarity action.
The roots of the plant don't come in contact with water also.
I did wrap an aluminium foil over the buckets as some of you suggested and it seems to drink less, probably about 4 litters per day.
I also used the fertiliser dose as indicated by Earthbox manual with respect to my bucket volume.
What has been done, has been done. It will be a lesson for the next year.
But, is there anything I can do to save the plant now ?
I'm glad you took the aluminum foil suggestion. Even though they are self-watering containers, there was no barrier to the reservoir around the perimeter of your pot because of the design of the bottom. I think that is a design flaw but in Romania maybe it is popular and works if the humidity is low enough, I don't know.
seysonn also commented the same thing in that thread, as he was concerned they were too moist, so I'm not the only one.
To see what can be done, water only once in the morning and remove everything to keep the top exposed to the air, in hopes it will dry out. Go lighter on the fertilizer, too. Good luck.